[xenophonf]

I'm amused at how thoroughly Google adopted Microsoft's playbook. Chrome supplanted Internet Explorer by embracing the open web. But then Google immediately started on extensions, and now they're trying to extinguish the open web with nonsense like Cloud Fraud Defense. All very smoothly done. I mean, people are actually _asking_ for this junk. I'm impressed.

[olyjohn]

No they didn't. Firefox unseated Internet Explorer. Chrome then got big by putting its installer right on the Google homepage and harassing users to install it. And they had it bundled with other software, and would install as a user so that locked down computers could still run it. They absolutely did not win by embracing open standards.

[ocdtrekkie]

People forget that Sundar Pichai's entire claim to success at Google was injecting the Google Toolbar into the Adobe Reader installer which would hijack your search and browsing data on IE, and the launch of Chrome, which was then also injected into the Adobe Reader installer, occurred because Google was concerned IE might block or limit their toolbar.

People absolutely did like Google at the time, but the majority of its growth is actually shoveling hijackers into other software installs just like BonzaiBuddy.

[lotsofpulp]

I recommended everyone to use Chrome simply because Microsoft couldn't be bothered to provide built in PDF viewing and creation.

There was a good, long period where Microsoft just decided to let the market run amok with malware for critical software, instead of providing something like Preview on macOS. As a result, the safest option for most lay people was to use Chrome, where they could quickly and easily view, and most important, save pdfs of websites, receipts, etc.

Then, once MacBook Airs were solidified + iPhone, I started recommending people use macOS simply because Preview could edit PDFs and easily allow signing them.

I haven't used Windows in a very long time, so I assume it's still the same situation.

[traderj0e]

Yeah I remember when Windows lacked every basic utility that Mac OS had. The most common malware was PDF readers, because a very common search was "how to open pdf." Same with zip.

[vel0city]

Chrome and v8 was just stupidly faster than any other browser and JS stack at the time when I first adoped it. It was a lot buggier in many other ways and many sites just didn't work quite right at the time, but the tradeoff on performance in the early days was very much worth it.

[traderj0e]

Chrome has gone off doing their own standards to some extent, but you're forgetting what it was like when Internet Explorer dominated. You basically couldn't use the web without IE because they broke so many standards and implemented them in closed source. Then there was ActiveX on top, straight up Windows binaries in web. And besides there being a dominant engine, only one browser could use that engine. Trading that for Chrome dominance was at least a step up.

I use Firefox right now. Occasionally I need to open a site in Chrome instead, but it's rare.

[ndriscoll]

Chrome didn't solve that though. Quoth Wikipedia:

> Firefox usage share grew to a peak of 32.21% in November 2009, with Firefox 3.5 overtaking Internet Explorer 7, although not all versions of Internet Explorer as a whole;

Firefox was the browser that embraced open standards and was unseating IE. And ActiveX was used for corporate stuff, not general web sites, so the main reason it died was that Microsoft gave up.

[traderj0e]

Eh, it was brief and never majority. Chrome was the first to truly usurp IE.

[generalpf]

I just got a Docusign and it didn't work in Firefox, I had to use Chrome. That's a huge blow right there. (I sent negative feedback about this to Docusign.)

[traderj0e]

I vaguely remember running into that too a few times, strangely not on every doc. Also one particular part of the Chase mortgage website.

[lotsofpulp]

I recall Chrome being a superior browser in the early days, prompting many to switch and evangelizing it.

[traderj0e]

It was the first to do a separate process per tab, which had security and stability benefits. But it also used like 2x the RAM from the start.

[homebrewer]

Lots of supposedly technically advanced users switched to Chrome en masse and promoted it on every occasion they could, because it was so much faster, simpler, safer, etc etc. Don't excuse useful idiots from their share of the blame. People warned about dangers of Chrome's growing domination for about as long as I can remember, back to at least 2012, only to be dismissed as paranoid.

[narrator]

If I may tie this into other things going on, The California wealth tax as written would force Larry and Sergei, if they didn't move out of California, to basically sell almost their entire stake in Google, and it would probably wind up owned by State Street and Vanguard who outsource their proxy votes to ESG consultants, who will probably vote for more surveillance.