[dismalaf]

> Being perhaps a little smarter doesn't mean you win the evolutionary game. There are so many factors at play.

Considering most human groups have a % of Neanderthal DNA, they didn't exactly lose... Based on the % of Neanderthal vs. Sapien DNA, it seems Neanderthals were simply outnumbered.

[hrimfaxi]

What does it mean to lose evolutionarily if not be outnumbered?

[dismalaf]

Are numbers everything? Are sardines more evolved than whales?

Anyhow, the traditional view is that Neanderthals were brutes who were actually out-competed and killed off by Sapiens. The more realistic view considering the evidence is that Neanderthals were much closer to Sapiens, equally or even more sophisticated, but less numerous, and thus their contribution to our DNA is smaller than Sapiens.

But do keep in mind the Neanderthals live on because Europeans and Asians are all part Neanderthal.

[peyton]

I think especially given TFA and our inferred history with them that they were terrifying apex predators who occasionally raped human women.

I don’t much believe the friendly smiling museum depictions that have lately become fashionable. Their eyes alone would have made them something you didn’t want to run into at night.

[dismalaf]

> TFA and our inferred history with them that they were terrifying apex predators

All humans are. Neanderthals, Sapiens, modern humans, we are all apex predators.

> occasionally raped human women

The article doesn't suggest that. While it's plausible, there's also evidence of Sapien/Neanderthal cooperation and mingling: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2026/04/260412071005.h...

And lets not forget that all hominins fight amongst themselves, rape each other, etc... The assumption that Neanderthals were particularly brutish is just that, an assumption.

[card_zero]

There is however a suggestion here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neanderthal#Interbreeding

> According to Svante Pääbo, it is not clear that modern humans were socially dominant over Neanderthals, which may explain why the interbreeding occurred primarily between Neanderthal males and modern human females.

Unless read as suggesting "Neanderthal males were hugely charismatic"?

[dismalaf]

In current-day interracial dating dynamics there are preferred race and gender combos and this is shown through lots of statistics.

The answer isn't necessarily rape...

[pegasus]

...or "Neanderthal males were huge, thus charismatic" :)

[opan]

Are there any good illustrations showing how much bigger their eyes were compared to modern humans? Is it really significant? I'm having trouble finding anything that makes it clear.

[nobodyandproud]

I kind of agree. Though the old, brutish yet stupid was also likely wrong and more for self-comfort as a species.

Tangent and thought experiment: If we could re-engineer a viable population of neanderthals, should we?

If we further gave them the full gamut of modern knowledge and tools, and even a nation-state suitable for them what would be the outcome?

[tsunamifury]

Ants won over humans? Worms?

[hrimfaxi]

When you are in direct competition? I should have said outcompeted, which in this case I think outnumbered is a fair proxy.