[jadbox]

I'd love this. I really don't want my car to be an iPhone with "apps" and random background software on it. The car touchscreen was perhaps the worst design choice in the history of the automobile, and is likely the cause of countless crashes. It's insane when I see car UIs that have the 'cancel / go back' button located in DIFFERENT areas depending on the screen context.

[hypercube33]

I favor my 2018 car with knobs and buttons but has car and android auto and a modern turbo inline 4...just wish it had metal valve covers and coolant joints instead of crappy plastic...

[appplication]

I always thought of it this way: software engineering/UI/UX to most car companies is a cost center. Something to be minimized, workers to be provided minimal resources and pay. The compensation is not competitive with what you’d find at a tech company, but they’re hiring from the same talent pool.

The effect of this is obvious and felt in the end product.

[throwaway85825]

The irony is cars got screens largely due to the backup camera mandate which was intended to be a safety feature. Governments are very bad at understanding unintended consequences.

[fineIllregister]

- The mandate is for rear visibility. Car manufacturers choose to implement it with the back-up camera. Beyond that, it's obviously safer to be able to see everything behind the vehicle.

- My vehicle has a backup camera with a screen, but has physical buttons for all controls (A/C, audio system). There's no reason cars can't have both.

[rootusrootus]

> The mandate is for rear visibility

Specifically, 10 feet by 20 feet directly behind the vehicle. I'm actually curious how this could be achieved with only mirrors. That's a pretty big swath for anything with a viewpoint where the driver is sitting.

> My vehicle has a backup camera with a screen

Early implementations just used a screen in the rearview mirror. No need for any kind of infotainment screen.

[throwaway85825]

In rear view mirror display is mostly just on GM products.

[rootusrootus]

Nah, it was relatively common on base models that did not have a head unit with a screen, and that definitely includes Hondas and Toyotas, for example. The most common type of vehicle to use such a setup were pickups. For Toyota, the Taco and Tundra are the only vehicles I can think of which used an in-mirror screen. Honda did it in the base model CR-Z. Ford, Chevy, and RAM did it on their trucks.

[horsawlarway]

my 2011 F150 has a rear view mirror backup display, and it's quite nice.

It's there when the truck is in reverse and otherwise just a normal mirror.

Early 2010s actually seems like a sweet spot for a lot of automotive tech - it's decent enough, but "mobile" wasn't really a thing yet, and bandwidth was expensive, so there's no assumption that everything should be an app phoning home yet (iPhone was still brand new).

[throwaway85825]

When it already has a screen it's much cheaper to get rid of the buttons then. The screen as a requirement is priced in whereas the buttons are not and thus cut.

[sparrc]

A screen for the backup camera doesn't necessarily mean everything has to be through the screen at all.

Most Toyotas I've seen have a screen for the backup camera and the carplay/music/gps console, but everything else is still knobs and buttons.

This is true on both my 2013 and 2026 Toyotas.

[rob74]

I last had that on a (rented) Fiat 500: the "standard" controls (including the monochrome LCD in the instrument panel) looked really clunky and old-fashioned, and all the advanced features (audio, navigation, mobile phone connectivity, not sure if it had a backup camera) were via the (third party, Pioneer) entertainment system which was state-of-the-art with a nice high-res touchscreen. That's probably because this was the more expensive version of the car, I guess the "basic" version only has a radio - no navigation, no backup camera, no nothing. Not sure if it's the same principle at work at Toyota, I haven't driven one in a while?

[Pfhortune]

Also true on my 2020 RAV4 and 2025 Tacoma.

I tried a 2025 Ford Maverick for a year before I traded it for the Tacoma. All the AC/Heat/Etc controls were on the screen. Couldn't stand it. Put me off of ever considering a new Ford again.

[magnetowasright]

Not all screens are touchscreens. Manufacturers complied with those regs without touchscreens for years. My 2012 mitsubishi's reverse camera is displayed in the rear view mirror; the head unit is a dead simple dot matrix display which I adore.

It's the regulations (or lack thereof) that allow touchscreens in cars as they are that should be the target of ire. Reverse camera regulations or not, the current state of touchscreen car rubbish was inevitable without the existence and enforcement of regulations addressing it.

[brokencode]

Are you suggesting that governments shouldn’t require safety features because car manufacturers might implement them badly?

[throwaway85825]

The EPA push for fuel efficiency made it easier to hit targets by selling huge trucks instead of small cars.

There is a value in safety regulation but the incentives as legislated have led to negative results. It needs to be fixed or repealed. Not sure there's a clean solution here.

[BirAdam]

Not only huge trucks, but all vehicles got larger.

[arijun]

The backup camera mandate is associated with a 78% (!) reduction in fatalities in children in backover incidents. That’s a pretty high bar to cross to prove that the camera is more harmful the it is helpful, especially since, as others have said, you don’t have to use the screen for anything else.

[arthurjj]

I was pretty curious as I have a kid who's not very aware about cars. That appears to be an extrapolation from a pretty biased source [1]. It's probably more honest to say "the aforementioned systems are expected to save 58 to 69 lives each year" after they are fully rolled out to the entire fleet.

That's not counting injuries or property damage, but it is still an already low number

[1] https://www.kidsandcars.org/news/backup-camera-mandate-linke...

[2] https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2014/04/07/2014-07...