[throwa]

@davidw, Just use emberjs and focus on your app instead of boilerplate code. If you are coming from rails, emberjs is opinionated and should fit your style of thinking.

Emberjs makes building non-trivial easy while backbone makes building non-trivial apps hard but makes building small simple app easy.

People like talking about the size of emberjs but after you finishing stitching together numerous boilerplate code, you might end up with a bigger code base than emberjs and you are worst off as you have to maintain your boilerplate yourself rather than use a community curated codebase.

Two good getting started tutorial: http://trek.github.com/ http://emberjs.com/guides/router_primer/

Please i don't dislike backbonejs but we should use the right tool for the right job, backbone is not the right tool for non trivial app except you like boilerplate code. I also respect Jeremy Ashkenas. So my comments are not hate induced.

[crescentfresh]

> use the right tool for the right job

"Backbone is the wrong tool for anything non-trivial" is just hyperbole.

[atomical]

Getting started with Ember is a lot harder than your comment admits. I tried Ember recently and there was still a lot of stuff that was broken including the data model. That would make building a non-trivial app hard.

[throwa]

@atomical, the link to trek's article above puts it more succintly:

Ember applications start out with a complexity rating of 4/10 but never get much higher than 6/10, regardless of how sophisticated your application becomes. Backbone starts out at 1/10 but complexity grows linearly. This is a natural side effect of the types of applications the two frameworks were specifically created for.

[davidw]

What I'm investigating Backbone/Ember/whatever for is a semi-embedded device that will ship with a web interface, so some semblance of stability is a major plus.

[throwa]

As we speak it is used in production by many companies. Click this link to see them all:

https://github.com/emberjs/ember.js/wiki/Production-Deployme...

Shopitome is a very fresh deployment using emberjs based on this tweet sent today:

http://twitter.com/inkredabull/status/268017623428657153

http://www.shopittome.com/threads/signup

A few non trivial companies using emberjs in production are:

www.zendesk.com

http://www.squareup.com/

http://livingsocial.com/

http://www.groupon.com

http://www.desk.com/

http://basho.com/

http://travis-ci.org/

http://www.gooddata.com/

[davidw]

Web production != shipping on devices production. You can very easily ship updates to the former whereas the latter is tricky. It means we need to be careful with everything we choose.

[camus]

Does Ember have a persistance layer ? like backbone sync ? anyway ,Ember is far from perfect too. The best javascript framework , though not free , is Ext JS.

[throwa]

Yes it does. I have added enough links that touch on that.

https://github.com/emberjs/data

http://emberjs.com/guides/ember-data-lifecycle/

https://speakerdeck.com/tomdale/30 slides for the video below

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djhAsWGOImk Tom Dale - Ember-data

https://speakerdeck.com/tchak/ember-data