[egorelik]

Rust opened the door to innovation in the low-level languages space, but as long as it is already the most theoretically advanced practical language there, it will always attract the audience that actually wants to push it further. I don't know if there is a way to satisfy both audiences.

[layer8]

A similar thing happened with C++: The fact that it had a relatively high complexity of interacting features (already 30+ years ago) that you could use to do smart things, did attract smart people with a high tolerance for complexity. And with such an audience, complexity tends to expand up to the limits of tolerance (or even a little beyond).

Rust had a better start, not the least because it wasn’t designed on top of an existing language like C++ was, but who knows what it will look like in 30 years.

[estebank]

I think there is: a schism. Another language, inspired, intelligible and interoperable with Rust, but with other goals, likely ease of use or surface simplicity. In my mind it would be pretty much the same as Rust, but whenever a compile error gives you a suggestion in rustc would instead compile (and at most be a warning in this hypothetical language). Migrating from Rust to this language would be changing a single setting in Cargo.toml. The other way around would be fixing a bunch of compile errors. You could use the entire crate ecosystem in a native way. This language could also serve as a test bed for features that might or might not be suitable for Rust. It can also have a more aggressive evolution schedule, meaning that it wouldn't be perma-1.x, so it can be bolder on what is attempted.

[teh]

There is precedent: with type checkers like pyright you can opt into specific checks, or have a basic, standard, strict setting, each expanding the set of checks done.

How would dependencies work in this schism? E.g. if serde starts using named impls, do all dependencies have to use named impls?

[selfmodruntime]

I'd take `Rust with a GC and specialization` over current Rust any day.

[simonask]

I mean… Sure, if we’re just making stuff up, a compiler that can magically understand whatever you were trying to do and then do that instead of what you wrote, I guess that’s a nice fantasy?

But out here on this miserable old Earth I happen to think that Rust’s errors are pretty great. They’re usually catching things I didn’t actually intend to do, rather than preventing me from doing those things.

[nicoburns]

> But out here on this miserable old Earth I happen to think that Rust’s errors are pretty great. They’re usually catching things I didn’t actually intend to do, rather than preventing me from doing those things.

As it happens, you are replying to the person who made Rust's errors great! (it wasn't just them of course, but they did a lot of it)

[simonask]

I bow to them and thank them for their service!