[cthalupa]

Look. I think the Chinese AI companies are doing a lot of good. I'm glad they exist. I'm glad they're relatively advanced. I don't think the entire nation of China is a bunch of villains. I don't think the US, even before the current era, is a bunch of do-gooders.

But China has some of the most imperialist policies in the world. They are just as imperialist as Russia or America. Military contracts are still massive business.

I also believe the petrodollar will fall, but it isn't going to be because China built exponentially more solar panels.

[nl]

I think a lot of the conflict about what imperialist policies means is different framing.

For better or worse, inside this the border in this map China has fairly imperialist policies. Outside it not so much: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Map_of_National_Shame

That's different to the expansionist imperial policies of Spain in the 1500s or Britain in the 1700s. It also affects a very large proportion of the world's population. That Wikipedia page has some good links for further reading about this.

But it's an important point when considering China's place in the world.

[cthalupa]

We're talking about the modern world, though. China's imperialism over the past half century is not significantly different from any other major world power. The choices we have aren't 1500s Spain or 1700s Britain vs. 2000s China.

And Belt and Road is the Marshall plan writ large, and it was considered to be one of the largest imperialist plans ever by the USA, and B&R covers many many countries outside of that map. You'll notice all of these loans they've offered have very favorable terms for them - it's arguably many times more exploitative than the Marshall plan.

[teyopi]

> But China has some of the most imperialist policies in the world.

Citation needed?

US and allies have invaded or intervened in 20+ countries in last 20 years in the name of "western values" where values means $$$$ and hegemony.

Educate me please with a comparison of what China has done to be "some of the most imperialist policies"?

[ninjagoo]

> Educate me please with a comparison of what China has done to be "some of the most imperialist policies"?

Tibet occupation. Taiwan encirclement and ongoing military exercises. Strong-arming African and Asian countries that made the mistake of signing up for belt & road. Tianenmen Square. Illegal Foreign Police Stations. Uyghurs/Xinjiang genocide and concentration camps. Repeated invasion and occupation of Indian territory in North East and North West. The Great Firewall of China - occupation and suppression of its own populations. Ongoing Han settlement of Tibet, Xinjiang and other ethnic regions. Violent destruction of Hong Kong democracy (that was condition of handover). Spratly Islands occupation. Attacks on Filipino shipping and coast guard. Ongoing attacks on Japan's Senkaku Islands.

[cthalupa]

Tibet Hong Kong / Macau Taiwan Everything constantly in the South China Sea Belt and Roads is effectively the Marshall Plan but even bigger - Africa being the major example, but also Eastern Europe, parts of the middle east, etc. Over 100 countries. This exact playbook is what sets up the infrastructure and reasons for military intervention at a later date - protecting your investments.

[sinuhe69]

Maybe it's time to learn some facts https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Vietnamese_Wars