[spwa4]

The real problem is that for >10 years the a green-left coalition was in power, at least in most of Europe and immigration was greatly encouraged because it would provide clear economic benefits for everyone.

There's many stories, but let's call this the average story: "Immigration brings growth, growth advances everyone".

Well, it doesn't, at least not at the moment. Oops.

Now we can argue why, of course, but a certain amount of backlash was to be expected. It was clear for 20 years or more exactly what would happen when "the alternative" to the prevailing "left+green" coalitions gains power. To an extent I don't understand how anybody can claim to be surprised.

Also, in a democracy I would think that arguing that "the uneducated masses" are wrong is a quick path to irrelevancy. That, by the way, is exactly how we want the system to work. The system needs to work well for the uneducated masses. Figure it out, or accept that the other guys are going to win the election.

[JCattheATM]

> Well, it doesn't, at least not at the moment. Oops.

No, it still does.

> but a certain amount of backlash was to be expected.

Ultimately by lower class people who tend to be racist, though. Mostly it's just that they don't like seeing new languages and foods popup.

> in a democracy I would think that arguing that "the uneducated masses" are wrong is a quick path to irrelevancy.

Maybe, but the uneducated masses shouldn't be making these decisions, which is why democracy is the real problem here.

[spwa4]

> Maybe, but the uneducated masses shouldn't be making these decisions, which is why democracy is the real problem here.

Do you seriously think progressives will come out on top, or even have much of a say at all, in a non-democratic system? I mean, really?

... which suggests that if you can't lift up and convince "lower class" people, racist or otherwise, you should just get out of the way. Because if that's the case the only outcomes are bad, and worse.

[JCattheATM]

> Do you seriously think progressives will come out on top, or even have much of a say at all, in a non-democratic system? I mean, really?

I think a superior system to the one we have now is one where progressive values are embedded in from the start. Objectively, they are superior positions that can be backed up by data.

> which suggests that if you can't lift up and convince "lower class" people, racist or otherwise, you should just get out of the way

These people routinely vote against their own interests. They shouldn't have a say.

[spwa4]

If you think so then just vote in your favorite "data-driven" dictator. I'm sure it will all end well.

[JCattheATM]

There's no one to vote for proposing a system that I would approve of.

[spwa4]

That sounds like a very good thing.