[chatmasta]

That system is nothing compared to the geolocation databases curated by Apple and Google, with GPS sensors combined with Wi-Fi wardriving, IMEI tracking, cell tower handoffs, and the rest of the insane amount of telemetry they collect collect in real time. And that’s before even considering BLE and the Find My network. Imagine the “God mode” dashboards they could have in Cupertino (or more likely, in Mountain View).

[cluckindan]

Imagine a Google Maps / Google Earth where you can see everyone’s location and identity in real time, with tagging/targeting/following capabilities and quick links to thorough personal profiles.

[mystraline]

Or Palantir of NOTHANKS.

[aembleton]

And see everyone they interacted with in the last 24 hours

[cluckindan]

Not only that: also nth-order interactions (Alice—Bob, Bob—Charlie, Charlie—Deborah, …), connectivity clustering, time spent in same location heatmaps, etc.

[riffraff]

but one can choose not to use a device which is tracked, I cannot opt out of other people's cameras.

[yndoendo]

These devices are very few in reality. One reason why I keep investing in almost every company that makes a Linux based smartphone. Still need the 2FA and digital magazine for the loo.

Even large retails install bluetooth tracking in their buildings now. Was interviewing for one of them and they ask what you would use that style of tracking for to support the consumer. Giving the consumer a reason to use it helps validate and maximize the meta data.

[jauntywundrkind]

I'm sorry but I just don't think that's the threat at all. I think these companies actually realize the existential risk and harm this data has, and do a lot to anonymize it quickly & effectively. If the government was actively backdooring Apple or Google to get realtime data like this, it would be found, and it would be a shitstorm that would greatly impact these companies.

We really need to get a little more discerning in our hatred. Apple especially I think is a real piece of work. But there are so many worse hideous monsters out there. Clearview AI just signed with DHS for access to a facial tracking database. Flock is out here basically giving playbooks to law enforcement to tell them to use only the most vague indirect reason when asking for data. There's so many other even less visible but incredibly dangerous data-broker foes to society, doing such harm.

Google and Apple have a level of caring far far far far far far above the vile anti-human campaign happening now. I just think you are off by a million miles, that you're not even on the right planet, for where the actual real harm is coming from.

[int_19h]

Google literally has a partnership with Palantir, whose software is underpinning ICE activities right now.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/alphabet-palantir-team-superc...

[jauntywundrkind]

I hate it!

But that seems far different to me than directly making their own products whose express purpose is to send data to the feds / local law enforcement.

Google is not a huge data broker selling your data to the world. They keep that inside, & sell ads based in data they have. But if they started trying to be a data seller or data provider, like Amazon has been, I think they realize that would almost surely be a huge crisis.

There's many good reasons for all the big tech hate. But I do think that Google and Apple have extremely strong incentives to not become a go-to everyday source for law enforcement, I think the person I was responding to has a level of suspicion that is wildly over critical & hyper rampant, and I think we would know if stuff was that bad, and I think we would all be a lot more pissed & many people would have found the door out by now.

[RalfWausE]

Those companies are all in the same unethical goddamn country, controlled by the same unethical goddamn goverment.

Where is the real harm coming from? America is the answer.

[kakacik]

The past gives a lot of lessons, all negative ones. Power people are endlessly greedy for more power, there is no end in that spiral. All top folks are like that, if you look for the signs you can see it in their behaviors outside PR rooms. Sociopaths to the last one, all big names and then some more.

So, when in doubt, feel free to have good faith in these behemoths. I don't. Secret court orders for example can force any company into anything, and it can be pro bono for some gov contract later. Why would they disclose this, ever? We had Snowden and others.

Come on lets be realistic here, all that data is a wet dream and ultimate goal of any 3 letter agency all around the world.

[dataexporter]

Amazon?