[yesturi]

Today, storage is so advanced that to the ordinary user it simply presents as some kind of non-leaky abstraction: small rectangular shape, no moving parts, stores blocks, retrieves blocks, low latency, high reliability.

Back then, the storage is was much more 'real': it was slow, made noises, degraded noticeably because of stray magnetic fields etc, complicated mechanical parts. By the hearing alone, you may spot problems.

[hinkley]

The first time I installed Slackware I didn’t have enough spare floppies to get the whole thing, I had to delete some things to do so, and then copying it in the computer lab lead to several dead disks. The installer didn’t yet have a retry feature so every time a disk turned out to be bad I had to make a new copy and start at the beginning. And sometimes that disk would be bad too. So the first time I installed slack I really installed it ten times.

Do not recommend.

[ofalkaed]

Up until a few years ago my Slackware install was broken up over 4 flash drives, as Slackware grew I never bothered to buy a new flash drive big enough for it. It was a lot like the old floppy install. Eventually I realized I could just put all the packages on an external drive and greatly simplify things and then I snapped out of the old habit and just bought a few new flash drives.

[medstrom]

That's not so dissimilar to my experience in 2025 with whatever USB drives I can scrounge up around the house!

[casets]

> Back then, the storage is was much more 'real': it was slow, made noises, degraded noticeably because of stray magnetic fields etc, complicated mechanical parts. By the hearing alone, you may spot problems.

And it also could involve manual manipulation of things holding the data.

I may not have ever worked with lots of switches or cards or big reel-to-reels, but for our family’s first computer we had a Radio Shack cassette player that I could hook to it to load software. It was an ordeal to put in a tape, rewind if necessary and coordinate pressing play on the cassette tape player with the load command I had to enter in to load a program. Those were the days!

I could also record and load my own programs from the tapes. Press the record and play buttons at the same time and hit enter on that keyboard!

Granted our first computer also had cartridges, but I only had a few for it.

It was like Christmas (or literally was Christmas) whenever we got new software from anywhere, whether it was from Radio Shack or a bookstore that had a few or more tapes available.

That’s why I started to program. It was fun, and it was the only way to get new software whenever I wanted it. Early on it was entering programs from the manual, but I learned quickly to write my own.

When I later got a 5 1/4” floppy drive, it was so awesome, especially once I got an Apple and could trade/copy disks from others, stores, a local college, and the library.

Even once we got a modem, you still had put the data somewhere, so it went on floppies.

Everything was physical and novel then. It was so awesome.

[ddingus]

Same feels here too. Cassette was kindnof magical and kind of crappy. Well, depending on your machine, potentially very crappy.

One of the better cassette loaders can be found in the 6809 based Tandy CoCo machines. When in the cassette times, I would stress test various machines.

My Atari was bog slow, reading a block at a time, with a pause between... And it was picky and really wanted the dedicated cassette drive. Not recommended at all..

Apples were pretty OK, along with the Tandy machines. The Tandy reader software, whoever wrote it, took full advantage of the nice CPU and 6 bit DAC. I could rest a finger on the tape, slowing it down, then listening to the wow, flutter and speed changes all over the place while the machine recovered. Almost always loaded correctly.

The Apples were not that robust, but worked well enough to not be a big bother.

Both Apple and Tandy machines had good commands for loading and saving right to regions of RAM.

On the Apple, with the spiffy Mini-assembler, it was possible to develop big programs a piece at a time, saving off stuff that worked.

Every so often, it made sense to read a bunch in and save off a nice chunk! Always felt good doing that.

Eventually, you load it all, patch it up, linker style, maybe moving bits around some, and then save it as a completed assembly program.

No source, just the data on the tape and what the mini-assembler would show you when you list memory.

Good times!

[kergonath]

> By the hearing alone, you may spot problems.

I still have PTSD from those Zip drives. You could hear your data disappearing into nothingness as you watched powerless the drive hacking away at your cartridge.

[Lutzb]

Same with QiC80 drives. You could hear when the drive failed to read data.

[el_benhameen]

I’ve been working on archiving a bunch of old hard drives and floppies that my parents found and gave to me when they were cleaning out their garage.

Aside from the fun of seeing all of the old contents of the drives, it’s also been fun to walk through the progression of storage devices through the years. Lots of cool sounds and form factors, including an early Conner hard drive (that I have unfortunately been unable to archive), which is built like a tank and makes some great noises as it spins up and seeks.

Also cool to learn a little more about how the various storage media worked. It all feels very simple when you abstract it all away into bytes and blocks, but there was some wild engineering in those things. If you stop to look back, it’s impressive that we’ve made it this far.

[WalterBright]

I knew my PC was booting normally by the sound of the floppy drives.

[ebergen]

I keep an optical drive in my desktop for the sound it makes when it boots.

[colincooke]

Oh man, this reminds me of my "party trick" back in the day of saying I could tell what OS a computer was running by listening to the HDD seeking. The good old days

[VTimofeenko]

You can't just drop this without examples. What OSes and what were their tells?

[userbinator]

Not that poster but I can also tell the difference in sound between filesystems, likely due to how they store their metadata and the resulting seek patterns. This is my subjective experience:

Linux ext* series - mostly silent, but even periods of high disk usage tend to be on the quieter side - probably due to lots of caching

MacOS - continuous, low-pitched "gritty" sound

Windows FAT - periods of silence punctuated by occasional intermittent groans

Windows NTFS - low rhythmic grunting, more continuous than FAT

Windows 9x - rather quiet, although periods of heavy activity can produce quite high-pitched seeking sounds

[numpad0]

It's not something that can be easily written out in text form. More like a pronounced version of how an iPhone feels when you're force rebooting.

[VTimofeenko]

Not an iPhone person, however when I force shutdown a laptop I am hacking away on, I do feel like I am strangling it with a pillow to ease it's suffering. But that feeling comes purely from my side, the machine shows no signs of life at that point anyway.

Are you referring to something like the GPRS staccato coming from speakers catching a cell phone call or the almost imperceptible flyback whine of a CRT?

[pixl97]

>By the hearing alone, you may spot problems.

Yep, was pretty easy to realize when you may have a bad sector on a floppy.

Even hard drives were more than loud enough you could tell when fragmentation was getting bad or the disk was starting to act suspect.

[ddingus]

Brzzzzt, tuk tuk tuk tuk brzzzt brzzzt tuk brzzzzt brzzzt

I/O Error :(

You listen to the initial slamming of the head to zero align it, then those happy little tuk, tuk sounds.

It all good, until it isn't!

[mr_toad]

In the computer labs at university we taped a sign over one machine to warn people that its floppy drive would reliably destroy disks.

[afandian]

And yet was an absolute marvel of engineering. I often used to wonder at the accuracy and reliability they got out of those stepper motors, trying to imagine the size of the tracks.

Fun thought experiment. The 128 GB SD card on my desk could store a 1-bit bitmap of 1,000,000 x 1,000,000 pixels. Imagine shrinking that down to the size of the die, and how small each (logical) cell is.

[yesturi]

Maybe that's the charm of mechanical watches? Precise metal parts moving in harmony. You can entertain yourself with analyzing its workings by simply watching it (no pun intended).

Precise, but featureless digital clocks lack "soul" which you can actually see.

[ddingus]

For sure. And early specimens are worth a close look if you ever get an opportunity!

Humans can do amazing things! One of those things happens to be really precise, tiny parts literally willed into existing.

[hinkley]

There was a hacked driver you could get that would tighten up the tolerances of the stepper motor and get from 1.5 to 1.9 MB of data onto a single floppy, but sliding the tracks closer together.

There was I believe at some point a game that shipped 1.5MB disks as a copy protection mechanism. But if you had this tool you could copy them anyway.

[userbinator]

Are you referring to 2M/2MGUI? That didn't change the track spacing (which is fixed) but used bigger sector sizes (similar to how HDDs went from 512B to 4K physical sectors):

https://retrocomputing.stackexchange.com/questions/27412/how...

(Big fuckings to Wikipedia for erasing history, and kudos to archive.org for preserving it: https://web.archive.org/web/20241203124243/https://en.wikipe... )

[hinkley]

No they definitely did more tracks, but it seems to be a smaller multiplier than I recalled.

https://retrocomputing.stackexchange.com/questions/12768/wha...

2-5% more tracks, 12.5% more sectors.

[userbinator]

The track spacing didn't change, but yes, many if not all floppy drives could step the head slightly past the officially supported number of tracks.

[hkpack]

Stepper motors were last used for HDDs with the capacity in megabytes.

[afandian]

I was thinking 5¼ floppies actually. But the same applies to the voice coils in newer hdds.