[carlosjobim]

> We built a social infrastructure that encourages a sedentary, solitary life.

No. Pro-exercise propaganda has been extremely strong for longer than you've been alive. Large parts of the economy is focused on exercise and health, and it is accessible to everyone.

But it sure feels better to think that every problem is "society's fault". That's the easiest and cheapest cop-out. Just takes a few seconds to type on the keyboard, instead of doing something.

[digbybk]

I’m not sure what you’re advocating for. Is “pro-exercise propaganda” hinting that you’re against exercise? I think it’s cheap and easy to dismiss large scale social problems as the individual’s responsibility. We badgered people to exercise and change their diets while the obesity problem got worse and worse. The first time we saw an improvement was with the introduction of GLP-1s.

If your goal is to feel self righteous, keep believing the problem can be solved if people just get stop being lazy and join a club already. That’ll work for some people, but what I’m saying is it’s not a solution to the problem.

[carlosjobim]

I'm very pro-exercise myself, and there is no denying that exercise, athleticism, sports are celebrated everywhere and anywhere you turn, and has been so for decades. And it's not only the propaganda, everywhere there are gyms, yoga studios, sports halls and fields for a great variety of sports, running tracks, bicycle tracks, promenades.

Athletic clubs and sports clubs are a core ingrained feature of both rich and poor societies, and for all ages and abilities. Whether that is just playing a sport for fun once a week as a social activity, or serious endeavors for top talents aiming for Olympic gold or a pro career.

Any kind of sporting equipment you want or need are available for purchase, whether it's an expensive sport or cheap sport.

Athletes are celebrated and greatly admired, and top athletes can reach superstar celebrity status. As well as a big pay-check.

So I completely disagree that the "social infrastructure" encourages a sedentary and solitary life. The "social infrastructure" is very pro-exercise, pro-sports and pro-health.

> If your goal is to feel self righteous, keep believing the problem can be solved if people just get stop being lazy and join a club already.

As Prince sings: "Do what you want, nobody cares". Finding a physical activity that you enjoy is greatly beneficial for you. Whether it's a social sport, or exercises you do alone. You do it for yourself, not for anybody else. And everybody can find something which they like.

Righteousness has nothing to do with health or exercise.

[digbybk]

We're not disagreeing that exercise is good. I also happen to be very pro-exercise. What I'm trying to do here is reckon with the fact that, as you say "exercise, athleticism, sports are celebrated everywhere and anywhere you turn", and yet the obesity epidemic only got worse. And providing the same kinds of answers for the loneliness epidemic will show similar results. It's possible that this disagreement is rooted in differing understandings of what "social infrastructure" means.