[tsunamifury]

I’m going to add a strange note here:

I recently moved into a very upper class neighborhood (pacific heights) and enrolled my child in the neighborhood private school.

The social hosting skill I’ve observed and and able to do as well is extraordinarily high. People throw parties, know how to act, are cordial and polite and seem to reasonably enjoy each others company while also teaching their children the same.

This is how I remember mere middle class parents acting in the late 90s and early 2000s but my fellow millennials and z seem to be completely incapable of.

One huge aspect I’ve noticed is that it’s wildly expensive in time and money to host. An open cocktail night cost me nearly 3000 dollars to host. I can imagine this would not be common for Gen Z these days.

[deeg]

That seems to be a very narrow definition of a party. I have friends over for pizza and board games. We've had ice cream making parties. Cheese dinners.

[tsunamifury]

This is fine too. Seems like most can’t even attempt that though.

[oblio]

Can't or won't?

[notenoughhorses]

I am a millennial and my parents did no events, since they both worked and had long commutes. I wonder when the middle class entertainment slowed down—I want to guess it’s when you have more two income households, that don’t earn enough to hire home help.

[vee-kay]

Minimum wages have not increased in decades. Cost of living has increased a lot meanwhile, and the rich vs poor divide has increased. So lower class and middle class are suffering, while upper class have become richer from their labors. In earlier generations, the middle class could work for some years and afford to buy a house (on mortgage). But these days, middle class cannot afford a house, they live in rented apartments. Hosting parties is the least of their priorities, when they are struggling with the monthly bills.

[ethbr1]

Housing availability and leisure time (afforded by excess income) are probably the biggest components.

And in answer to "When that changed?" from parent, my guess would be mid-90s.

In that generations coming of party-hosting age after that were increasingly less likely to host.

[astura]

I don't think it's that, my parents weren't two income and never had friends or did events or social things and barely left the house.

My mom would constantly complain she used to be a social butterfly but having kids "ruined" that for her. Which never made sense to me, it's not like she ever interacted with us much.

[groby_b]

How the heck do you manage to host a $3K cocktail party?

You can run an open bar with two bartenders for 50 people for that price? (Unless everybody is a complete lush, I guess ;)

[bawolff]

I can easily imagine a high end catered party costing that much.

I don't think there is an upper limit on how much hosting a party costs. You can always go fancier if you have money to burn.

[mmcgaha]

Christmas dinner for my immediate family almost $500. That was pretty much dinner and our favorite appetizers but does not count the liquor and wine. This was just me, my ex, five kids, a daughter in law and grandchild. I can see getting to 3k pretty fast.

[cpburns2009]

How did you spend $500 on dinner for 9 people? I hosted Christmas dinner for my family with about 10 adults and 10 kids, and it cost at most $200 divided between 5 families, alcohol included.

[hypeatei]

Dinner for twenty people at $200 is farcical in the US unless your family owns a farm or something. Going to need more details because I'm inclined to say that's bullshit.

Beer and liquor alone would blow past that figure.

[cpburns2009]

No farm is needed. It's not that hard. I spent about: $25 on a chicken dish (chicken from Costco + ingredients), $15 for baked mac & cheese (ingredients from Meijer), $20 on ciders, $40 on 2 bottles of Cherry Republic wine. The other family members: $20 on raw vegetables and cheese platter; $20 on fruit; $10 potato dish; $10 vegetable dish; $15 on dessert; $15 on salad. Oh and $2 on juice boxes for the little kids (~4 from a juice box 40 pack from Costco). I'm estimating what the others spent, but that's what it would cost me to make the same dishes. That totals to $192.

[groby_b]

"host" implies in your home, not in a restaurant.

If your version of hosting is "let's outsource it and just open the wallet", then, yes, sure, you can spend a lot of money. It ain't hosting, though. You failed the "what if I just replaced you with a bank account" test.

[hypeatei]

Yes, I know what hosting is and $200 for that many people is still farcical.

[tsunamifury]

Well 50 people attended. So. Yea? Two parents for 21 students or so plus a few extras.

[roel_v]

GP said 'open bar with 2 bartenders'. I.e. commercially priced drinks, and staff. Did you have those? If so, pro tip, next time just get a few cases of various drinks, plonk them on a table with a bunch of glasses (rented, if need be) and call it good. People can't drink soft drink for more than, say, 3 USD worth in an afternoon; and even if you served 12 years Glenfiddich to everyone including the children, enough of it to knock them all out, you still wouldn't have spend more than $1000.

So yeah still wondering what sort of party you threw. I mean, yeah it's easily possible to spend that much, but it's also possible to do it for much less and you don't even need to really try.

[throwup238]

> If so, pro tip, next time just get a few cases of various drinks, plonk them on a table

That's not a cocktail party, that's a tailgate.

[groby_b]

> GP said 'open bar with 2 bartenders'. I.e. commercially priced drinks, and staff.

GP here, and no, that doesn't mean that.

It means you hire 2 bartenders to make the drinks, and you buy the supplies they use.

And, no, if you want a cocktail party, you don't "plonk a few cases of drinks on the table". That's also a fun party, but a different kind.

[tsunamifury]

This is not a 'pro tip' this is a clueless tip.

[ljm]

That honestly seems quite cheap for 'very upper class' where I imagine everyone's suited and booted, dressed up for the evening, possibly some live music, etc.

[tsunamifury]

Correct. I did not spring for live music or help.

[lbrito]

People surprised by Mr. $3000-cocktail party's expenses are forgetting about class and wealth differences.

Up to a point, expenses are elastic and proportionate to income. Across different incomes, things like "dinner" or "cocktail" mean (and cost) very different things, to the point that someone on either end of the scale doesn't even know what is on the other end. A very wealthy individual might not know about the $1.50 Costco dog, and a less wealthy individual won't know about the $10,000 bottle of cab sauv (okay I'm making that up, I don't know either, but you get the point).

If you have $100k you'll make do with that, if you have 10x more, most people will find ways to scale the expenses accordingly. If you have 1,000x more, that's just wasted cash that does nothing for society, but that's another discussion...

[tsunamifury]

Also bog standard middle shelf cocktail liquor, wine, glassware, food, and additional (forks, knives, small plates, food prep) for 50 people is gonna cost 3k almost anywhere.

I was highlighting partially how it's just generally expensive to host the first time a large group.

[pardon_me]

What planet are you on? $60/head for a simple party with middle shelf drinks and basic food is necessary "anywhere" for passing acquaintances?

[oblio]

> glassware, and additional (forks, knives, small plates)

Do you guys break all the plates like at traditional Greek weddings?

[tsunamifury]

No you have to buy it for the first time though.

It’s amazing to me how classically foolish so many HN comments are.

[dbspin]

I know the US is ludicrously expensive, but 3000 dollars for a cocktail party? Did you have a couple of hundred guests? The kind of party where you can lock in friendships, have meaningful conversations and personally play host tops out around 30 people. At those kind of numbers, you really don't need to hire a staff - you can provide canapés and make cocktails and or have a friend so at very reasonable cost. Source - I had hundreds of (often fairly raucous parties) at my old apartment. Alas I no longer live in a basement so my entertaining options are much more limited.

One is reminded of this - https://x.com/dril/status/384408932061417472?lang=en

[tsunamifury]

I was not looking to 'lock in life long friendships.' I was hosting a cocktail party as a favor for our school at my home and was obligated to ensure the overall experience was somewhat nicer than 'a wild party at an apartment' as fun as that is as well. These are somewhat normal things as part of a knit-community adult life. You have distant people come as well as close friends and open your home. That is ... hosting.

Partly what I was trying to point out is how 'adult life' gets complicated and expensive and most people are understandably just opting out. But at the same time, whats going out with it is just basic manners and social habits -- which is unfortunate.

[dbspin]

My point stands - if anything a cocktail party is potentially less expensive to host since you know in advance numbers and preferences.

> These are somewhat normal things as part of a knit-community adult life.

As something of an adult myself (I'm 46), I'm well aware of how community functions. I'm also aware of the 'keeping up with the jones' nature of wealth and how corrosive that is to community - being entirely founded on the selective and exclusive nature of spending.

My contention stands, there is no need whatsoever to spend thousands on a cocktail party. One doesn't need to 'opt out' of social life. It's perfectly possible to serve cocktails yourself, to buy 'off the shelf' brands rather than expensive whiskey etc. It's perfectly possible to prepare your own food, or work with a chef who organises 'super club' style catering, which does not cost thousands.

It's a choice to live this way, not a fate. And doubtless it affords status among other high worth individuals - just as it dooms you to a life of fruitless comparison and ostentatiousness.

[tsunamifury]

This can be said of literally anyone living in the first World.

I find it deeply laughable anyone would stand on a soap box who lives in a modern first world environment and lecture like this while not seeing the irony that they do it themselves at their level as well.

Please. Stop. Look around. And maybe visit a place where you see how the other half of the planet lives. Likely your world is wildly ostentatious and unnecessary comparatively.

The plank in your eye before your neighbor and all that.

[yamilg]

for $3000 you can cover a decent 100 people wedding in my country.

[tsunamifury]

California, and San Francisco specifically has become "Hyper-Monoaco without the fun"

[pdntspa]

Three grand! For a cocktail night?

I mean I've spent a couple hundo at Costco buying booze and food and paper supplies for a party I hosted and THAT was flabbergasting. How the fuck do spend three grand on cocktails? Is it like all top shelf liquor or something?

[tsunamifury]

Hosted cocktail parties are generally not “paper plates and red cups”.

It’s interesting that you’re proving my point. General manners and expectations have been lost

[pdntspa]

It's a level of excess whose loss is probably a net positive for society. I would argue that there are very, very few cases where such a level is justified.

[tanseydavid]

>> I recently moved into a very upper class neighborhood (pacific heights)

A neighborhood which is sometimes referred to as "Specific Whites" (but only tongue-in-cheek, right?)