[RickJWagner]

A good question.

As the ACLU notes, Obamas use of ICE is similar to Trumps. I believe if people are sincere, they should condemn either neither or both.

If they refuse to condemn Obama, but do condemn Trump, I do not believe they can make a good argument about compassion. That may change the conversation, which I think would lead to a more logical discussion.

[thrance]

You've used this Obama deflection half a dozen time already, and everytime you do people will answer that they were never fans of ICE, even under Obama. Yet you continue to use it, again and again and again... The real question is why, among all these blatantly illegal actions and violent acts perpetrated against the US population that we keep hearing of, you still feel the urge to jump in and defend ICE and Trump?

[RickJWagner]

Because the Democrat politicians encouraging the agitators are aligned with Obama.

Obama is a great orator, and a historic figure. If we don’t remind people that he used ICE much like Trump did, we could end up with a historic injustice. If you call Trump a monster for his use of ICE ( as the ACLU does ), you should also call Obama a monster ( also as the ACLU does ). It’s only fair.

If it’s still not clear, I’ll give a historical example. Bill Clinton molested several women, paid out large sums of money, etc. The man was a lech. But women’s organizations supported him and gave him cover for several years. ( I.e. NOW, the national organization of women ). Clinton was named ‘Father if the year’ by some organization. Can you imagine how this galled people on the other side of the political aisle? It seemed there was no end to the hypocrisy. Finally, thankfully, #MeToo came along and the truth was acknowledged.

That’s why I keep throwing this out there. The truth must be acknowledged. You can’t call Trump a monster without calling Obama a monster, too.

[thrance]

> That’s why I keep throwing this out there. The truth must be acknowledged. You can’t call Trump a monster without calling Obama a monster, too.

Except no one is disputing this "truth". You're making up a strawman. Clearly, no one on the Left cares to defend Obama over his use of ICE, you must have realized this by now. But you keep bringing him up whenever ICE does anything illegal or abhorrent (which is daily now). Why is that? And I am yet to hear you condemn anything.

> Can you imagine how this galled people on the other side of the political aisle?

Not really, when the current President was Epstein's best friend, a known pedophile, and is embroiled in several rape affairs. Clearly the Right does not care about women, they even ran on an anti-feminism agenda. When Trump said "grab her by the pussy" during the campaign it did not make any waves in right-wing circles.

On the other hand, outside of the most dickless liberal circles, people on the Left are extremely quick to criticize/condemn democratic leaders: Biden, Obama, Clinton... Even Harris, people were extremely mad over her awful campaign.

Meanwhile, I am yet to see a single republican criticize Trump over literally anything. The guy did multiple crypto-scams, received obvious bribes (one of them an entire plane) from islamic dictatorships, is knee-deep in a major international pedophilia scandal, etc. Dead silence from the right.

Like right now, you keep deflecting whenever ICE does something bad. I have not seen you even acknowledge that ICE stealing from citizens is bad. You keep doing whataboutisms for some reason.

[hypeatei]

> And I am yet to hear you condemn anything.

Because he doesn't[0], he's just a troll that likes hearing anyone to the left of him say that Obama Was Bad.

0: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46558062

[thrance]

And the moderators are nowhere to be seen. I'm really tired of this bullshit, I wish they would clean this website of these obviously bad faith actors who only bring negative value to the table.

[RickJWagner]

Here’s Mike Pence on Trump: https://www.cnn.com/2026/01/07/politics/video/src-pence-on-j...

Here’s Mitt Romney on Trump: https://pbswisconsin.org/watch/newshour/mitt-romney-s-full-s...

Here’s George Bush: https://enewspaper.latimes.com/infinity/article_popover_shar...

So I don’t understand why you say Republicans don’t criticize Trump. As you can see, they criticize him very harshly, for a number of things. Please explain what you meant.

Now for the Democrats, please show me an article about a Democrat disowning Obama for his use of ICE. The bigger the politician, the better.

[hypeatei]

Mike Pence, the one that Trump sent his supporters to hang on Jan 6th for "betraying" them? Bush and Romney who don't hold office and don't hold influence over the populist MAGA movement?

Republicans in Congress (the ones who can hold him accountable) are clearly sycophantic towards Trump, but you know that, hence the irrelevant politicians you named.

[thrance]

FFS stop talking about Obama. Why are you acting like Trump didn't make the situation 10x worse? We already told you we didn't like Obama's ICE. That is completely irrelevant to the conversation.

I think you made your point, anytime ICE shoots at civilians or steals stuff from citizens, it's OK because Obama or ACLU or whatever Fox News told you to think. Got it.

You are yet more living proof that republicans are completely unable of going against Trump on anything. You guys will keep deflecting, changing the subject and using other fallacies to avoid it. (These three dudes you mentioned were de facto excommunicated from the GOP, Pence was even threatened by the Jan 6 thugs that wanted to hang him for not stealing the election).

If your next comment does not contain an acknowledgement of the most basic fact that "ICE stealing from citizens is bad", (something they did not do under Obama btw), this conversation is over.