[pilif]

As much as I like to hate on a new OS like the next person, I think it's worth pointing out we're probably not seeing the full picture here:

When trying to reproduce the problem as shown in the article by resizing the Safari window currently displaying the article, the drag cursor changes shape at the visible border of the window, not the shadow and consequently, dragging works as expected.

https://youtu.be/kNovjjvYP8g

This might be an application- or driver specific issue, not necessarily a common Tahoe issue.

[monooso]

I'm not sure "it works this way in Application A, and this other way in Application B" is a particularly strong rebuttal.

[pilif]

It wasn't meant as a rebuttal. Just as a point of thought: By showing that at least one application doesn't exhibit the problem, I thought I was showing that the problem might not be related to the Tahoe redesign at all but might have other causes.

It definitely serves to prove that this is not a design-issue but just a simple bug and thus has at least some chance of being fixed.

FWIW, I cannot reproduce the issue demonstrated in the original article with any window of any application on my machine (M1 Mac Studio), but I thought that listing a very commonly used application alone would be enough to challenge the article's assertion ("the macOS designers are stupid because they make me do something that doesn't make sense in order to resize windows").

[throwaway132448]

> It wasn't meant as a rebuttal.

“As much as I like to *” is a common way to start a rebuttal (the subsequent “I’m not going to see/do that” is implied by that turn of phrase).

> but I thought that listing a very commonly used application alone would be enough to challenge the article's assertion

So it was a rebuttal? Why the disingenuous doublethink?

[froddd]

This is absolutely true. The demo in the original article seems quite deceptive in that respect. Nobody would attempt to resize a window by launching their cursor at the corner with great speed as the demo shows. The resize pointer seems to show in exactly the right place, and allows for an extra hit area slightly outside the rounded corner — I don’t see any problem with that.

As for the fact that one cannot resize from inside the window, it makes absolute sense for every other corner of the window, where the user would instead be clicking an icon or some other button (try the top right corner of the finder, where the search button sits).

So, while I agree on the whole that Tahoe is a huge step backwards in terms of design, this seems like an odd gripe to point out, as it doesn’t in fact seem to be an issue at all.

Edit: clarification

[pilif]

> As for the fact that one cannot resize from inside the window,

if you check the screencast I posted, you'll see that you can indeed resize from inside the window. Not by a huge margin, but definitely from inside the actual window boundaries.

[froddd]

Indeed, just enough. And the correct resize pointer shows all along the rounded edge, so I agree, this doesn’t seem like the problem it’s made out to be.

[Sweepi]

> Nobody would attempt to resize a window by launching their cursor at the corner with great speed as the demo shows.

... great speed? Interpolating from the zoom, I would say its not fast at all.

[froddd]

I’m referring to the demo in the original article. The mouse pointer moves rather rapidly onto the inside of the window. You can just about see the resize pointer flashing as the user does so. I don’t think I ever attempted to resize a window with such erratic mouse movements. Approaching the corner at reasonable speed shows the resize pointer where expected.

[Sweepi]

> I’m referring to the demo in the original article. The article from noheger.at? I am also referring to it. My guess is that the pointer speed is exaggerated due to zoom of the gif, and/or that we are using the mouse in different ways.

[froddd]

Yes, that demo. You can clearly see the resize pointer flashing briefly, but the user continues aiming right inside the window. I’m not sure why he’s not stopping when the resize pointer appears. It seems erratic.

[afandian]

Arguably the feedback via the cursor change is feedback to help you learn, like the icons that appear in the close / minimise / zoom, or stickers on the keys of a musical instrument. You pretty quickly learn which one is which, or you can't use them effectively. At some point you'd hope that common actions become muscle memory.

So if it was something that was learned whilst using the previous version, and worked, I'd argue it wasn't 'erratic'.

[GreenWatermelon]

Judging by this comment https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46599464

It seems to be common.