[mixel]

It's not shocking they added even more bloatware to every microsoft program so even with the same OS kernel it would probably take longer. At this point it also got out of hand for Microsoft themselves if you have heard how they are going to speed up the explorer. Not by making it faster but by preloading it on startup so it feels snappier, there are 20 years of technical debt in I think you cannot save this anymore (but I am to inexperienced to know that for sure)

[mapontosevenths]

The last time this subject came up someone in the thread jumped up to explain to me how Windows 11 has all these great new features that make it worth being many times less performant.

Every feature they listed was some anti-consumer thing that only a corporate customer would ever care about or want. Every single one.

What I learned is that Windows 11 is great for the customer, I'm just not the customer. I'm just the dummy who paid for it.

[greenavocado]

- TPM 2.0 requirement

- Secure Boot enforcement

- Microsoft account requirement

- BitLocker device encryption tied to MS account

- Hardware attestation

- Telemetry/Data Collection

- Extensive diagnostic data collection

- Advertising ID tracking

- Activity history syncing

- Bing integration everywhere

- Edge as persistent default (difficult to change) - OneDrive integration/nagging

- Microsoft 365 upselling

- Copilot integration

- Widgets panel with MSN content

- Start menu web search forcing Bing

- Centered taskbar (not moveable)

- Simplified right-click menu (hiding options)

- Removed taskbar features (no drag-to-taskbar, no ungrouping)

- Start menu ads/recommendations Update Control

- Forced automatic updates

- Limited update deferral for Home users

- Feature updates bundled with security updates

- Device Management (Enterprise)

- Intune/MDM integration

- Windows Autopilot

- Azure AD requirements

- Remote wipe capabilities

- Monetization

- Ads in Start menu

- Ads in File Explorer

- Suggested apps

- Pre-installed third-party apps (Candy Crush, etc.)

[ewoodrich]

FYI, nearly all of that UI/app garbage can be removed (or re-enabled like the Start/context menu) in <5 minutes with:

https://github.com/Raphire/Win11Debloat

It persists across updates, can be customized with extremely granular control over what is removed/re-enabled, or using the default mode which works fantastically for most users with minimal risk of disabling something many people might prefer to keep (e.g Xbox app).

I’ve been using it for years on every machine/VM with Windows 11 installed. The OS gets out of my way completely both in terms of functionality and distractions like ads.

I cannot recommend it enough, I am eternally grateful to the maintainers for making Windows 11 feel like a modernized Windows 7 experience.

[ncpa-cpl]

Forcing OneDrive :/

[CTOSian]

you guys def have no idea about LTSC...

[aleph_minus_one]

Where can I get the LTSC version of Windows 11 as a private customer?

[nar001]

You can't in a legit way, but if you find an ISO of it (like on massgrave) you can install it and activate it

[ncpa-cpl]

let me read about it

[t0bia_s]

Most of it are turned off or possible to turn off in LTSC IoT version, which is only Win version reasonable to use without beenig annoyed when using it.

[gruez]

This list really needs proofreading.

>- BitLocker device encryption tied to MS account

Unless something changed with 11, this is opt in, with a specific "save to your microsoft account option". I really don't see the issue here.

>- Hardware attestation

This is either a rehash of the "TPM 2.0 requirement" point above, or just outright false.

>- Telemetry/Data Collection

>- Extensive diagnostic data collection

This are the same thing restated

>- Forced automatic updates

>- Limited update deferral for Home users

Again, these are just the same thing.

>- Feature updates bundled with security updates

That's basically... every commercial OS out there? Good luck getting security updates on android (if your OEM even provides it) if you're not on the latest version. Some linux distros even have it as a selling point, aka. rolling release.

>- Device Management (Enterprise)

>- Intune/MDM integration

These are the same thing AND you have to jump through hoops to enable it. I really don't see the issue here.

>- Copilot integration

>- Windows Autopilot

You can just... not use it?

>- Azure AD requirements

???

Is this just restating the microsoft account requirement?

>Monetization

This is a restatement for half the other points.

>- Start menu ads/recommendations Update Control

>- Ads in Start menu

>- Suggested apps

>- Pre-installed third-party apps (Candy Crush, etc.)

All stating the same thing.

[davkan]

To be fair, while many of those are indeed optional or non-issues, the problem is that user experience has been degraded in w11 while there has been almost zero value-add for end users.

[dawnerd]

FYI you can change the taskbar alignment.

[duskdozer]

Hm, I asked Copilot and it told me everything you said was a nasty, nasty lie.

[tartoran]

Let's not even go there. Copilot is .. just bad. I'm not surprised though.

[flufluflufluffy]

One random little thing to add on to the list of shitty things about Windows 11: the new default image-viewing program (Photos), is incapable of rendering multi-page TIFF files. No error message or anything, just displays the first page and acts like everything’s fine. The OLD image viewing program (Windows Photo Viewer), displays them no problem though…

[qnleigh]

These kinds of issues can be incredibly disruptive and distressing for non tech-savy users. You update your OS and suddenly it looks like a lot of your data are corrupted, with no explanation of how to get it back.

Forcing saving to OneDrive causes this issue a lot too. I was stunned to find that saving changes to an existing document will often try to save a new file in OneDrive instead. So if you don't notice this and go back to your original file, it will look like your changes weren't saved.

[bob1029]

> there are 20 years of technical debt

The only part of windows that really matters in the long run is win32 which has been extremely stable. You could go back to XP and not lose that many features. The fact that modern windows runs like ass has very little to do with backwards compatibility.

[driggs]

Windows 2000 or Windows XP - with security updates and modern hardware support - is exactly what I want.

[greenavocado]

Zone94 is still releasing modern Windows XP distributions and OneCore API brings Windows 10-level app support to Windows XP.

https://github.com/shorthorn-project/One-Core-API-Binaries

[anal_reactor]

the fuck

[freedomben]

I don't necessarily disagree, but I do think there's an important distinction between technical debt and backwards compatibility. Yes The former can be caused by the latter, but I've worked in enough projects that didn't have to worry about backwards compatibility but were still riddled with technical debt to know that backwards compatibility is only one source of many.

[everdrive]

>Not by making it faster but by preloading it on startup so it feels snappier,

The oldest, worst, and most over-used trick in the (windows) book.

[smitty1e]

Sluggishness is the price we pay for freedom*.

*Corporate surveillance.