[ryandrake]

I think part of the fixation on "shoplifting" is that a Reddit video showing someone walking in and filling up a bag of merchandise viscerally gets people going in a way that "statistics about wage theft," "invisible employee-caused shrinkage," and "process/control failures" doesn't get people hot-and-bothered.

People will get mad because they visually saw someone steal a tube of toothpaste, but not care about other forms of mass-theft because it's not on YouTube.

[x0x0]

Beyond even the cops and DA absolutely refusing to do their jobs in any way, it also severely degrades the shopping experience.

You can either go to costco which is always mobbed, or if you make the mistake of going to Target, you will have to repeatedly get someone to unlock cabinets which hold laundry detergent, deodorant, toothpaste, etc.

[mindslight]

That's Target degrading the shopping experience. It's understandable how they make a cost-benefit analysis and decide to, but let's not absolve them of responsibility for that choice.

[x0x0]

Given the shoplifting levels, comprehensive lack of enforcement, etc they don't practically have a choice. See also SF whining a couple years ago because a Target actually reported all the thefts and it made Breed look incompetent. And the open retail-theft marketplace operated at 16th st bart.

[mindslight]

They have many choices. Off the top of my head: accept the higher loss, raise prices on in-store purchases of those items to account for the higher shrink, authorize their security guards to forcibly stop and detain people, put vending machines that unlock with a payment card (deposit) rather than employee-operated locks.

I don't know why you're continuing to absolve the well-capitalized corporation of responsibility for their choice of dumping externalities on legitimate customers, except as part of some gish gallop of reactionary talking points that lash out with blame for everyone but those directly responsible for the frustrating conditions.

[x0x0]

> gish gallop of reactionary talking points

Yes, indeed. I don't understand why you're not blaming the criminals and the incompetent government enabling them, rather than merchants with thin margins. Or us, for not being enthused about paying for the thieves.

[mindslight]

We can condemn each individual criminal for their personal choice to steal, but this does not have much bearing on the overall situation. There is no "government enabling them", rather there is a government that is necessarily choosing how to optimize its limited resources.

Meanwhile, a large store full of goods manned by a skeleton crew, which doesn't even hire a single person to chase down thieves, seems like quite the attractive nuisance. Why is it governments job to subsidize the security of this store's stuff through the threat of expensive post-facto enforcement against a bunch of judgement-proof perpetrators? Why do you keep absolving the well-capitalized corporation of responsibility and even agency ?

[mikkupikku]

There's also the part where reddit has communities of shoplifters who give each other tips and post propaganda about how more people should shoplift.

[pavel_lishin]

Sure, and a large part of those communities are people just cosplaying.

[mikkupikku]

Anything to maintain your belief that crime isn't real.

[vondur]

Ha, I watched this happen at a Target here in SoCal. A group of people filled up their carts (3) with clothes and shoes, rushed out the door to a waiting van. Security didn't even try to stop them at all.

[pavel_lishin]

Nor should they, tbh. A few hundred bucks worth of shoes isn't worth getting hurt over.

[ryandrake]

I would not expect an hourly employee barely making minimum wage with no benefits to even lift a finger to stop a potentially violent shoplifter. If it were me, I'd hold the door for them to get them out of there.