[BeetleB]

And then you get married and have kids and wonder why you have trouble paying the bills despite having a household income in the top 5%.

Then you discover that you really do need to know how much you are spending on sandwiches.

I went through this a bunch of times. Always hoping for an obvious smoking gun expense I could just cut. It always was many little things adding up.

[StopDisinfo910]

If your income is in the top 5% and you struggle paying bills, it's nearly always an issue with to much of your money stuck in mandatory expense: you are over mortgaged, or have to many car loans, or pay too much for the kids schools.

Budgeting can make that manageable by significantly lowering your living standard but small expenses are rarely the root cause.

[BeetleB]

It's not that your wrong (you are), but that budgeting will give you a fuller picture and help you align your spending with your values.

Paying too much for school? If cutting on those sandwiches means you can suddenly afford the school, would you choose to cut the school just because it's a clear, known large expense?

Earlier in my career I always wondered why people earning a lot more than me would not get lunch from outside or the cafeteria but would spend a lot of effort cooking and prepping the food for their work. Now I fully understand where they're coming from.

The little things do add up.

The point of my comment was that I too believed as you did. Always easy to believe things until you track your spending and see the actual numbers.

It's also how I know getting an 8 year old car without too many miles is the way to go.

[jaapz]

I think you underestimate the amounts some people spend on things like clothing, coffee, going out to eat and other stuff you wouldn't even think about

[StopDisinfo910]

Top 5% earner, we are talking at least 350000$ a year. That's a lot of coffee.

[BeetleB]

No one in this thread is saying coffee is the reason. They're saying the little things add up. Coffee alone isn't a lot. Eating out alone isn't a lot. A cozy warm temperature in the house in a cold climate isn't a lot.

Adding all of it together is too much. So you set the thermostat lower by 3 degrees. Pack lunches two to three days a week and cut down the coffee a certain percentage etc.

Cutting any one thing out altogether will significantly reduce quality of life and won't get you there financially. Cutting back a bunch on each category will.

As I said, back of the envelope calculations will get you whatever outcome you desire. Real actual spending data will tell you the real story. There isn't a substitute.

350K in Missouri will give you a vastly different lifestyle than 350K in Denver.

If you have everything you want, no need to track!

[StopDisinfo910]

> Adding all of it together is too much. So you set the thermostat lower by 3 degrees. Pack lunches two to three days a week and cut down the coffee a certain percentage etc.

Yes, I understand, I'm not stupid. I'm sure you can understand what's implied by my comment. I am saying all of that together is a ridiculous amount for a top 5% earner once summed.

We are not talking scrambling family of four here. At some earning level, difficulty paying the bill is nearly always structural.

It annoys people because it's easier to cut a cup of coffee than to admit you over mortgaged and the solution is obviously far less simple.

[kassner]

> Budgeting can make that manageable by significantly lowering your living standard

I’d say that budgeting allows you to see how far off your ideal standard you are living. Spending too much on the kids school can be a deliberate choice or an afterthought from 4 years ago. Budgeting lets you see that and be deliberate about those choices.