[surgical_fire]

> Identical in every respect other than those with the power to initiate legislation are completely immune to voter displeasure.

You are aware that those with power to initiate legislation are appointed by national governments right?

If you are unhappy with how your country posed itself in those propositions, you can and should vote for parties that have different stances.

[lenkite]

How do the people kick out a EU representative ? Without the power to do so, it is not a "democracy".

[surgical_fire]

There are elections for the EU parliament.

As for council or commission, I presume you can elect different national governments from time to time? I mean, unless you are in Hungary.

[hn_throw2025]

Your link to the Commission and Council is homeopathic democracy, right?

In the UK with a Parliamentary democracy, unpopular policy ideas can be abandoned. Manifestos are not always adhered to, but they typically include ideas that their canvassers can sell on the doorstep and there is robust media criticism when they abandon their promises. We have a strong history of U turns because our politicians are wary of unpopularity. The most recent big backlash was the Winter Fuel Allowance cut which was proposed by the two parties (with the Treasury pushing for it behind the scenes) and abandoned by both due to deep unpopularity in the Country. Even the budget this week had a run-up where various fiscal changes were unofficially floated through the media, to see which ones had the smallest backlash.

This is completely different to the EU, where the Commission and Council arguably get what they want even if it takes several attempts.

[gpderetta]

Interesting you say that, after the UK already passed the equivalent of Chat Control with cross party support, without the law being part of the mandate of either party.

[hn_throw2025]

Which is terrible legislation, I agree on that.

But my point elsewhere in this thread is that we have the ability for future governments to overturn unpopular legislation, something that is not unusual at all in the UK.

Consider it read/write versus write-only in the EU, which doesn’t give a damn about unpopularity.

[surgical_fire]

You speak as if the Commission and Council are somehow divorced from ne national governments of the member states.

Those are not Lovecraftian entities that came from undersea. Their members are appointed from the national governments. If you dislike how your country position itself on those organs, this should change your view on how the ruling parties in your country took decisions at the EU level.

[hn_throw2025]

Your theory is that democracy would trickle up. I am saying in practice it is homeopathic democracy.