[metalcrow]

As a very beginner practicer i've come to that conclusion myself, but how can the two be separate? If there is no self (or at least, there is a self but it exists in the same way that a nation or corporation "exists"), how can there be something to experience being? What separates the two?

[syawaworht]

My own experiential insight is not definitely not complete, so of course the guidance of a master or of course your own direct practice should be preferred.

But to the extent I have observed awareness, the idea of an entire "experiencer" is an extrapolation and fabrication. See how you generate that concept. And then, look closely at what's actually going on, there is "consciousness" of the components of the aggregate. (Maybe not dissimilar to some of the lower level mechanisms proposed in the article).

[metalcrow]

> the idea of an entire "experiencer" is an extrapolation and fabrication

Ok, makes sense.

> look closely at what's actually going on, there is "consciousness" of the components of the aggregate

Interesting. I'll try, but i would have to wonder what it means for some sort of element of the mind that cannot experience to nevertheless have consciousness. It's very confusing, especially without a good idea as to what to look for in regard to consciousness. I'll attempt this though, thank you.

[syawaworht]

Yea it's quite confusing and subtle, but there is something there. I'm not a teacher so I don't know how to phrase this to address where you are coming from, but I will say in general, our first reaction is to impose mental frameworks and preconceptions to try to understand things. Kind of what your first inclination is ("element of mind"), and of course the article and many of the posts here.

But I think it is all talking in circles, when the experiential truth can be directly observed (through practice). So I absolutely want to encourage your seeking.