[axoltl]

I do vulnerability research. Those things would do the exact opposite of what you're aiming for. They'd be received with glee by mercenary spyware companies, _especially_ being able to load things into higher levels of privilege.

[notepad0x90]

that wouldn't be a problem, apple signs extensions. In windows land for example, there are ELAM drivers for security software, they don't just hand them out, you basically have to convince people at Microsoft you're one of the good guys, in person.

[axoltl]

It means more surface (both from extensions themselves and the loader code), relaxation of things like KTRR/CTRR (you now need to add executable EL1 pages at runtime), plus the potential for signing keys to leak (Finding enterprise signing keys even for iOS is fairly easy).

As far as Windows goes, https://www.loldrivers.io is a thing.

[notepad0x90]

Yeah, loldrivers are a thing because any signed driver can load, vuln drivers with ELAM .. I don't know of any, I believe they're quite rare.

You have a good point with attack surface, but apple has a pretty robust system already for ensuring boot and lock security that doesn't rely on EL0/El1 security. I'm sure you know more than me about higher EL's like EL3 and secure world code that can take care of all that. I'm pretty sure they don't have to issue new signing keys either, matter of fact, why let even 3rd parties do this, apple themselves could expose a memory and file system dumping api without involving third parties. That way, they could sanitize away anything they consider sensitive as well. They can also require that the commands be issued over a physical/authorized usb connection.

Point is, there are very legitimate are critical cases where memory and file system forensics could be critical. From what little chatter I've heard, forensic software today is resorting to exploitation of the devices and those exploits tend to be abused for other reasons too.

[transpute]

Trusted high-privilege components, whether first or third party, are targeted for exploitation.

[notepad0x90]

Do you know of any reports where macos system extensions being abused this way? I've heard about windows drivers, but my impression was apple is doing this well enough to be a non-issue mostly?

[transpute]

e.g. zero day CVE-2024-44243, patched last year, https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/security/blog/2025/01/13/ana...

[notepad0x90]

That's a good one. To be clear, I'm not saying vulnerabilities don't or can't exist in system-extensions. I'm just saying that apple can publish and/or sign iphone extensions for a very limited use case like this, or publish an api/system service to do the same thing, if the concern is 3rd parties. The use case here is reading some memory and exposing that to authorized applications. I concede on the system extension part, but apple can still expose the capability without one.

[Too]

Crowdstrike showed us how good idea that was.

[notepad0x90]

Crowdstrike has system extensions on macos.