[fsckboy]

is there a game that is an abstract version of D&D?

i've always been curious about the gameplay, but have absolutely no interest in reading past words like "wizard", "mage", or "eldritch", and i won't look at anything where i have to see or imagine that somebody is wearing a cape, or even play with gamers who are willing to imagine they are wearing capes in other games.

[krapp]

Why do you have such an aversion to capes? There's no rule saying you have to play as a character in a cape.

If you're asking if there's a version of D&D that's pure math and no roleplay, the closest thing I can imagine would be Dragon Dice, or something with the mechanics of a very basic roguelike. The math in D&D itself such as in combat is affected by your character's stats and the encounters created by the DM, so the mechanics and the role playing are kind of tied together.

[vkazanov]

The thing is that dragons and magic and Harry Potter all become irrelevant at some point in life. Power fantasies do have an expiration date.

Now, the genre itself, all the storytelling involved, can easily be adapted to more serious, or even abstract, thinking.

In fact, it was, and there are plenty of alternative rpg universes. But, similar to how serious non-marvel movies are a niche, serious rpgs are also less popular.

[atakan_gurkan]

I understand where you are coming from, but I hope you realize this is very subjective. The things you mentioned and other elements of the fantasy genre do not become irrelevant for many people through their life, well into adult life as well. In fact, they may become irrelevant and become relevant again.

Just to make it clear (and perhaps to state the obvious), you are not believing in these when you play these games or read these books, you are voluntarily suspending disbelief.

[krapp]

They're all games. They're all escapist power fantasies. No one wants to role play a character who doesn't matter to the story, regardless of the genre.

[vkazanov]

Well, this depends on a story. Escapist? Yes. All of them, by the very definition of, ehm, role play.

Power? Not necessarily. Numerous rpgs have nothing to do with power. Be a Cat has nothing to do with power, and everything with escapism (and cats).

I mean, there is nothing wrong with power and fantasies. Or powerless fantasies, as in horror stories, or whatever.

[vkazanov]

There are literally 1000s of non-DnD RPGS!

I am also past the age of wanting to believe in magic. And also past the age of having time for long plays. Most of my friends are busy doing serious adult stuff.

So outside of baroque dnd-like systems, my personal favourite right now is a subgenre called journalling solo RPG, which are often minimalist, but covering all kinds of themes and topics.

[gwd]

I mean, the most important part of a role-playing game like D&D is... the role-playing. You're basically telling a shared story, with each player controlling one character, and the DM controlling everyone else. The fighting mechanics are sort of a mini-game inside the larger game.

If that's all you want, there are loads of combat games with miniatures. I've never played Warhammer, but that's obviously the biggest one; I've enjoyed the Star Wars X-wing combat game as well.