[andrepd]

It's a bit disingenuous to argue "they shouldn't get life without the possibility of parole" when in fact most of this economic white-collar crime goes completely unpunished, or at best gets a fine targeted at the company and never at the individual people who committed the crimes.

[catgary]

Most of these C-suite executives have more than enough money to retire comfortably.

[hnfong]

This is more justification for banning people who got rich by doing illegal things from holding positions of power ever.

Not to punish per se, but to prevent them from doing more harm to the public.

[andrepd]

Yep! So they need to go to jail, or the "punishment" is moot.

Obviously fining you 5$ for stealing 100 is not gonna work.

[marcosdumay]

What is disingenuous is claiming that putting a crazy punishment on the paper will change anything when absolutely nobody gets caught.

If you tear apart whatever guarantees human rights exist on your places just so your can impose unreasonable punishment to nobody, then don't act surprised when somebody else uses it against real people you sympathize with. (And yeah, if you are from the US or some other place where lifelong punishment is common, you should be fighting to fix this, not to add support to it.)

On the other hand, you could be pushing for those people being punished at all, by reasonable crimes that your law probably already recognizes or that could be added without rotting your society. But yeah, maybe that's too much.

[teiferer]

To the contrary. I do find it a disingenuous argument to say "most of this kind of crime goes unpunished, so the cases we do punish, we have to punish for life".

The solution is not harder punishments for those that are punished, but punishing more of them.

[hvb2]

Isn't that exactly how the criminal justice system works? Because you know you're not going to catch all the criminals you want the punishment to serve as a deterrent?

Punishing more of them is easily said, when the crime is much harder to prove than shoplifting for example. And I'm skipping the fact that the shoplifter will be represented by an overworked public defender while the exec has a team of lawyers lined up that probably are payed by the company that got richer off illegal behavior

[teiferer]

> Isn't that exactly how the criminal justice system works?

No, it's not. We don't catch everybody guilty of petty theft, but those we do catch still don't end up in prison for life.

There was a time when we chopped their right hand off, but I'm glad those days are behind us.

(Reading many of the reactions here though, we are just a thin layer of judges away from mob rule.)

[lux-lux-lux]

Petty theft nets up to a year in jail, which is far more extreme than - relatively speaking - than handing out lifetime sentences for the damage being discussed here.

[hvb2]

If the chances of getting caught are small, and the chances of being convicted are even smaller, should the punishment be harsher to have the same deterrent?

You do understand how the petty theft criminal represented by a public defender is at a disadvantage to the white collar criminal with an army of lawyers paid by the company?

"We should just catch more of them" is like saying we should just solve our energy problem by making nuclear fusion work. Sure, everyone agrees with that but that's just wishful thinking

[lazyasciiart]

No, it doesn't work. The US has been actively trying this in many states, so we have data on the relationship between deterrence effect and the likelihood*harshness of punishments - it turns out likelihood really controls the strength of the effect of deterrence. If you have extremely harsh punishments you DO incentivize doing a lot of damage to get away with it, and also incentivize repeat or exacerbated offending. (See: "might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb")

[hvb2]

Uh you don't have data on that for white collar crime. If you do, please share.

Petty theft is done for different reasons to white collar crime. I agree with you that the punishment is not a deterrence for small offences.

I think there's a lot of deterrence coming from the Enron case where people actually went to jail. That's just too rare because you quickly get into questions of intent. And to prove intent is really hard.

[jacquesm]

You're protesting a lot here.

[teiferer]

I do hate economic criminals just as much as everybody else. But I also value honest arguments. The kind of thing this reply of yours didn't provide.