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by JumpCrisscross 254 days ago
> UN calls it a genocide now

One, really important to specify that the Independent International Commission of Inquiry on the Occupied Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem, and Israel said this, not the UN as a whole. "The UN" is generally held to be the General Assembly.

Two, I'm not disputing that it probably is a genocide. I'm just saying that people have been calling it a genocide well before we had evidence it was one. As a result, the term has lost moral weight.

Put another way, I don't think support for Palestine increases by calling it a genocide again. I do think it increases by showing, specifically, what the famine means for the kids on the ground can change hearts and minds. (Nobody, at this point, is probably going to be swung on a fundamental opinion. People may, however, re-prioritise this politically.)
2 comments
ipaddr 254 days ago
It was called a genocide early on because of the disregard for civilian life but it doesn't become one until everyone dies. The more accurate term is war crimes.

At this point public opinion matters less than existing relationships.

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JumpCrisscross 254 days ago
> It was called a genocide early on because of the disregard for civilian life but it doesn't become one until everyone dies

The Holocaust was a genocide. It didn't exterminate the Jews.

> more accurate term is war crimes

Agree.

> At this point public opinion matters less than existing relationships

What do you mean?

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ipaddr 254 days ago
The relationship between Trump and Benjamin Netanyahu and between Israel and America military matters more than public opinion. It could be 90% against but that would matter less.
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JumpCrisscross 254 days ago
> relationship between Trump and Benjamin Netanyahu and between Israel and America military matters more than public opinion

The relationship is absolutely guided by public opinion. If Israeli support among registered Republicans starts hitting 50%, Trump is constrained.

It's currently 64% net sympathy for Israel and 9% for Palestine among Republicans. 55% of Trump voters say "Israel should continue its military campaign until Hamas is fully eliminated, even if it means the civilian casualties in Gaza might continue," while only 29% say "Israel should stop its military campaign in order to protect against civilian casualties, even if Hamas has not been fully eliminated" [1].

[1] https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2025/10/02/polls/times-s...

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LinXitoW 254 days ago
People called a genocide because if we wait for it to be bad enough to be called a genocide by even the most cynical person, too many people have died.

Quite frankly, the genocide of the Jewish people in Germany also started far sooner than just the final solution. But I guess "Never again" is just fancy words for pretenders.

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JumpCrisscross 254 days ago
> People called a genocide because if we wait for it to be bad enough to be called a genocide by even the most cynical person, too many people have died

No, what happened is the word got diluted into popular meaninglessness. ("It's not a war it's a genocide" doubling down on that mistake.) A lot of people called wolf early and often, and that did its damage. (I'm unconvinced they care. A lot of activism on this topic seems to be self serving.)

> the genocide of the Jewish people in Germany also started far sooner than just the final solution

Sure. We also didn't have international institutions whose job it is to investigate and identify genocide in WWII. Now we do. Turning "may be" and "at risk of" genocide into "is genocide" just means that when e.g. a credible UN agency determines it is genocide, the finding doesn't resonate.

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