[buggeryorkshire]

The built-in nav is always awful anyway.

My partner replaced her 11 year BMW 5 GT with a new X4 last month. The nav is slow (probably updates the view twice a second) and out of date. I think it needs new roads updating via a USB stick.

The Android Auto and Carplay integration are fantastic though - silky smooth (better than the phone they're coming from) and always up to date.

Who ever uses those built-in things?

[stetrain]

Built-in navigation is more important and useful for long trips in an EV, where you want the nav to have detailed information on how much battery charge you have left and incorporate charging stops along your trip.

That's basically Tesla's secret sauce, their charger network + in-car nav makes taking trips in an EV pretty easy.

Android Auto and CarPlay are starting to incorporate these features though for cars that support sending those stats to the phone.

[Enginerrrd]

>Who ever uses those built-in things?

I do. I use it only as a backup or corroborating source of info in situations where the maps are never quite right, but that happens quite frequently.

I spend a LOT of time out of cell-service though.

[buggeryorkshire]

Good point. Though certainly Google Maps (through AA) lets you download the route in advance so you don't technically need data.

[maxerickson]

Depending on data quality in the area you need, one of the many apps that use OpenStreetMap data can be a good backup option. Where I am in the US it is plenty reliable enough for highway driving.

[Enginerrrd]

Yes, I'm aware. And that's my default minimum starting place which works until you realize that google maps routed you through a private gated road and you need to readjust and reroute while out of cell-range. Or a large section of the road is passable only on foot or perhaps with a quad, but certainly not even a 4wd truck. Or it's convinced that you should simply "turn left!" off a cliff numerous times.

All of which happened to me just last week here in rural CA.

[wbl]

You do when starting a trip out of service. And sadly being a T-Mobile customer that's a good chunk of CA.

[reaperducer]

Check to see if you can download more territory.

On my car, deep in the options, is a screen that shows CONUS, and lets you draw a box around the portion you want to download.

I have a box drawn around an area about twice the size of California. Hopefully your car has enough storage for that size, too.

On those occasions when I'm out of a cellular service area, the map shows a banner reading something like "No cell connection. Using downloaded maps."

[therealfiona]

May I suggest caching/downloading your map data? Google Maps for example will allow you to cache areas. I used it when traveling cross country. Super duper valuable.

[bitwalker]

That's surprising, I have a '23 X6, and the built-in navigation is actually really nice. The maps have more detailed information than both Google and Apple Maps in many areas. I also haven't observed any lag/stuttering, but perhaps the hardware is worse or something on newer models.

Anyway, for me at least, the benefit of the built-in nav is not about routing, which is basically always worse than Google/Apple at this point, but about having detailed, offline maps. In my experience, offline Google/Apple maps are less detailed, and you have to download them in advance.

I use all three, depending on my needs at the time - each of them have their strengths. I prefer Google/Apple maps for day to day routing and things like that, but if I'm somewhere with poor signal, I use the native maps to navigate, because they are just more reliable.

It's all subjective though, and probably highly specific to location.

[Kirby64]

It’s awful if the vendor makes it awful. Know that this is deliberate lack of investment and not that it’s impossible. To my knowledge, there’s a few companies doing it right:

Tesla, whose nav is pretty great and responsive

Rivian, who appears to have copied a lot of the Tesla UI elements (and, has lots of former Tesla employees) and the snappiness and great nav is part of that.

Any car using Android automotive (different from Android auto) such as the Polestar lineup. Basically gives you an Android tablet with Google Maps, so nav is great, and it seems to be all held to a certain level of responsiveness.

[fourside]

Haven’t been on a Tesla recently but I really disliked the navigation system of the one we rented a while back. Small buttons, and common settings buried in multiple menu layers. What I like about Apple CarPlay and Android auto is that the UI is pretty consistent because it’s driven by the device I have with me.

[Kirby64]

I’d suggest that’s just a case of what you’re used to. I never use CarPlay except when I get a rental and every time I use it there’s a learning curve to relearn how it works. Just like any new UI honestly. As for Tesla nav in particular, I can’t really think of any nav elements “buried” in the UI except disabling toll routes or something. But that’s a sub-menu on almost any nav software, so not unusual.

The thing that is not subjective though: the UI is responsive and the map data isn’t extremely outdated. Those are the two primary problems with “bad” nav implementations.

[runako]

> just a case of what you’re used to

Also the reverse -- CarPlay knows where I have been, where I have searched, locations people have texted to me, locations in my calendar, etc. It's nice to not have to type in the address every time I want to go somewhere new.

[Kirby64]

Not quite as seamless, but for anything like that where you’re headed to a destination, you can always send the location to these various UIs. Tesla and Rivian support sending addresses to their cars via their apps (through the share functionality, so it’s basically 2 clicks).

For the calendar point, Tesla actually offers calendar integration and automatic navigation (if you enable it) to events that have locations near your current time. I don’t use it since my calendar isn’t heavily populated, but I could see that being super useful for certain people.

[dzhiurgis]

Whenever I need to use CarPlay in a rental I wanna scream. It's insane people consider this is good UX.

[Kirby64]

Its better than many alternatives, though. Try using built in nav in many cars. I tried using it in a Hyundai rental when CarPlay was having trouble connecting and it was so truly terrible. It was so unusable I spent the extra 10 mins just trying to fix my CarPlay connection.

[dzhiurgis]

> common settings buried in multiple menu layers

Are you sure it was Tesla?

[JustExAWS]

I would never buy a car that doesn’t have CarPlay integration. I’ve rented a Tesla enough times to know that their infotainment system is a reason not to get it.

[nonethewiser]

The built in navigation is a backup to preferred options like Waze, Google Maps, etc. via android/apple auto. You use those in normal situations and fallback to the car's navigation when you have to. It's not really competing with those nav solutions in my opinion.

Navigation does cost money though. Even maintaining a basic map.

[0cf8612b2e1e]

One thing I would love to see is more industry collaborations to make software. The nav system of Honda/Toyota/Ford is never going to be a differentiator on the core product. Chip in resources to get a core platform that each vendor can cosmetically tweak.

Of course, this never happens, because humans. Yet I still dream.

[eithed]

I imagine that it serves a purpose to demand a markup given that the car provides such capability.

[nativeit]

My 2012 VW Passat’s system was the most responsive and dead-on accurate GPS I’ve ever used in a car or a phone. The only thing that beats it are handheld dedicated GPS units designed for ships and rescue workers.

That said, the maps got out of date and couldn’t be updated without a $200 SD card, which was annoying.

[pfranz]

I have no idea about Android, but my understanding is for wired CarPlay a GPS in the dash is optional and for wireless CarPlay its required. The thinking is you can use a larger, better placed antennae. If you're using wireless CarPlay you may have your phone hidden away.