[o11c]

Literally any open-source forum or wiki meets all the requirements except possibly "federated" (depending on whether people set up a dump->restore to another machine), but is much more welcoming to ad-hoc contributors who don't want to subscribe to 10,000 emails per day just to get replies to their own posts.

If mailing-list users actually used CC properly this would not be a problem, but THAT IS NOT THE REALITY WE LIVE IN. Bad technical etiquette on behalf of the habitual mailing-list users is the main reason people hate mailing lists.

===

Editing to also reject some of the points from the article:

"1. Mailing lists require no special software" is utter bullshit. If you accept "must install a mail program", surely you can accept "must install lynx or curl"?

The contrast of 3/4 to forums is utter bullshit. What security/privacy risk is there in using a forum? Are they going to leak my email address or something?

... I don't even want to respond in detail to the rest of the nonsense that follows. Are they talking about some particular forum that hasn't been updated since 1999 or something? Yes these are problems which is why people have made solutions to them ...

[SoftTalker]

My problem with forums is that I am forced to use a web browser and access them through their provided interface. A lot of them, especially the older ones, are seriously hard to use and even worse on mobile.

Mailing lists I access with my preferred mail client and environment.

Receiving "10,000 emails per day" would only happen on a very active list. In most cases you're talking about a dozen or at worst a few hundred. Your email client can easily filter those into a virtual folder, and quickly find the messages where you are addressed or threads you're interested in.

Once I have the emails, I have them forever. I am not dependent on some forum remaining online five years from now if I want to go find an old message.

Web forums and wikis just suck for message-based interactions. Email is designed for that and it works really well.

[eschaton]

I find that people who complain about email volume are not only unfamiliar with setting up rules to file messages into folders, but entirely uninterested in learning how to leverage their tools that way.

In fact, it seems many of them resent having to learn anything in order to be more productive, instead insisting the burden belongs on others. “I don’t want to get all that email, so it’s OK for me to make you visit a web page several times a day to participate instead.”

And no, Discourse’s “mailing list mode” isn’t sufficient, it’s as garbage as the rest of Discourse, especially when D showed the right way to do this: Mailing list primary, NNTP newsgroup gatewayed (or vice versa), with a web forum for those who insist on one.

If only LLVM et al had gone that route.

[BeFlatXIII]

It's replicated work for every person who wants to set up filters and notifications. Discord or whatever has defaults that don't require everyone to create their custom environment.

[johnisgood]

But you trade a lot for not wanting to set up your own custom environment. You only have to set up yours. There is no one size that fits all, and if this flexibility comes with these features mentioned (non-proprietary, federated, archivable, accessible, not dependent on a specific company), then: yes, please! How could anyone not want this?

[eschaton]

“It sucks for everyone equally, so it’s better.”

Nah. The “replicated work” is in deciding what you want your mail folder structure to look like, which is a pretty personal decision; creating the filter on List-Id itself is trivial.

[theshrike79]

https://www.tapatalk.com/introduction is a thing

They use some kind of API to connect to forums and display them on mobile in a semi-unified UI.

There's nothing stopping anyone from creating an application that uses the same APIs and provides the contents in a more fitting format.

[LaGrange]

> Literally any open-source forum or wiki meets all the requirements except possibly "federated" (depending on whether people set up a dump->restore to another machine), but is much more welcoming to ad-hoc contributors who don't want to subscribe to 10,000 emails per day just to get replies to their own posts.

I know that mailing clients have gotten worse, but not _that_ worse.

> The contrast of 3/4 to forums is utter bullshit. What security/privacy risk is there in using a forum? Are they going to leak my email address or something?

Most of them employ a whole bunch of google analytics for reasons unclear. That should be sufficient.

---

Though unfortunately I disagree with the OP. Those are arguments as to why it would be nice if email stuck around. But it won't. Just because the problems come from "bad deployments of anti-spam policies" doesn't change the fact that the "bad deployments" are literally _the majority of email_.

[jjav]

> "1. Mailing lists require no special software" is utter bullshit.

Proprietary mediums require and are limited to specific software with limitied functionality, whether in the form or a specific application, or a web interface that only works one way and is missing most functionality.

With email I run whatever email client I like best and can filter, sort, thread, etc just the way I want.