[_t9ow]

> The accepted solution is to have a constitution that says otherwise

And the willingness and ability to enforce it. The current iteration of ChatControl is pushed by Denmark, which is at present the President of the Council of the European Union. The Danish Constitution itself enshrines the right to privacy of communication [0], but this is not stopping Denmark from wanting to ratify ChatControl anyway.

[0]: https://danskelove.dk/grundloven/72

[raverbashing]

Yes but unfortunately courts are mostly reactive, not proactive

Sometimes there are some mechanisms to block unconstitutional (or other regulation) laws from passing but they're limited

Not sure how that would apply at the EU level or even at the Danish level

[reliabilityguy]

> Yes but unfortunately courts are mostly reactive, not proactive

I think it’s always the case, no? Unless the unconstitutional law is approved, there is nothing to dispute in court.

[spockz]

In the Netherlands we have the “Eerste kamer” (first chamber, also called Senate) that is responsible for verifying that the proposed laws are in accordance with our “constitution”. They are elected of band with the normal government which should ensure that no single party is able to steamroll laws through both chambers.

[1718627440]

In theory the "Bundespräsident" in Germany is supposed to only ratify laws that are in accordance with the constitution, but I don't think it happens that he refuses to do this.

[KPGv2]

Correct. Imagine the number of challenges in court based on mere rumor of a law.

[rapind]

> but this is not stopping Denmark from wanting to ratify ChatControl anyway.

What the TLDR of the motivation behind this? Is it just politicians playing to their base (think of the children) or corporate lobbying. or religion, etc?

Seems to me that the negatives of passing something like this are super obvious and dystopian.

[_t9ow]

I suspect it's a mix of many Danish politicians' own authoritarian tendencies/ambitions and corporate lobbying, though I have no proof of the latter when it comes to ChatControl specifically.

Generally speaking, there is a lot of dark money in Danish politics, and the EU has repeatedly flagged Denmark as a country lacking in transparency with regards to corporate lobbying: https://www.altinget.dk/artikel/eu-kritik-af-danmark-puster-...

Generally speaking, the Danish government also tends to behave in authoritarian ways. E.g., Denmark has wilfully violated EU regulations on data retention for many, many years. In 2021, a Danish court ruled that the Danish Ministry of Justice could continue its mass surveillance practices even though they were (and still are) illegal under EU law: https://www.information.dk/indland/2021/06/justitsministerie...

Currently Denmark is also trying to leverage its position as the President of the Council of the EU to legalise, on a EU-wide level, the form of data retention that Denmark has been illegally practising: https://ec.europa.eu/info/law/better-regulation/have-your-sa...

[reliabilityguy]

Interesting. I am not expert on politics of Denmark, so my question is: is this push universal across political parties or it’s a feature of a specific political block that rules for the past X years and consistently worked in this direction?

[roer]

There was another thread on specifically our minister of justice, with comments that touch on the historical aspect: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45248802

[drdaeman]

Generalized, this looks to me like a question about why humans sometimes get hell-bent about some idea and become blind to the side effects and ignorant when it comes to risk management.

Sometimes it could be malice or personal gains. Sometimes, I think, it could be just a strong bias towards some idea that causes a mental blindness. Such blindness can happen to anyone, at any level of power (or lack thereof), politicians are not unique in this - the only difference is the scope of impact due to the power they have. And we aren't particularly filtering them against such behavior - on the contrary, I feel that many people want politicians to have an agenda and even cheer when they put their agenda above the actual reality, any consequences be damned.

[thatguy0900]

If I was leading another western nation I would be looking at the right wing takeover of the US government in terror.

[KPGv2]

For sure. Does anyone want Trump to know everything you write? Erdogan if Turkey ever does enter the EU?