[charcircuit]

>That’s true for any password manager

Modern operating systems isolate individual apps such that a malicous app can not access the RAM of another app. There is a difference between not making an effort to protect passwords and requiring an OS exploit to do so.

[codethief]

Memory isolation doesn't really help, though. If you have a malicious process running under the same user account as your password manager, it's still game over since that process could e.g.

- capture keyboard input - capture your screen - silently install browser extensions to capture your credentials - modify your shell config, .desktop files, $PATH, … to have you e.g. call a backdoored version of your password manager, or put a modified version of sudo on your $PATH that logs your password (=> root access => full memory access) - …

[johnisgood]

You can use Qubes OS for true VM-level isolation, or use hardware security keys where possible, or run sensitive applications in dedicated VMs.

I think that in general it is game over the moment you have malicious processes running. I use firejail for most applications, which I believe is the bare minimum, or bubblewrap.

[codethief]

Yeah. Personally, I'm crossing my fingers for SpectrumOS[0] to make things a bit easier. As the developer notes on her website[1]:

  <qyliss> I have embarked on the ultimate yak shave
  <qyliss> it started with "I wish I could securely store passwords on my computer"
  <qyliss> And now I am at the "I have funding to build my own operating system" level

[0]: https://spectrum-os.org/

[1]: https://alyssa.is/about/

[johnisgood]

What else can you tell me about Spectrum OS? Is it actively maintained? Is it usable? How does it compare to Qubes OS?

Also what do you think about Subgraph OS[1]? Although I think it is not maintained anymore, or is it?

[1] https://subgraph.com/img/sgos.png (old image which I remembered it by) (https://web.archive.org/web/20241206072718/https://subgraph....)

[codethief]

I don't know how usable SpectrumOS is so far – I guess we'd have to compile it ourselves in order to find out. Either way, it is being developed quite actively, see https://spectrum-os.org/git/

As for how it compares to Qubes, I don't think I'll be able to tell you more than https://spectrum-os.org/design.html & friends. I suppose the upshot is:

- KVM instead of Xen

- One VM per application

- Single file system for user data (to which users can grant VMs access on a folder-by-folder basis)

- Package system from NixOS (nixpkgs) for reproducibility & immutability

[codethief]

Ugghh, once again I forgot that HN removes line breaks unless you use double line breaks or indent by 2 spaces, and now it's too late to edit my comment.

@dang People keep running into this. (See e.g. this comment[0] from a few days ago.) It also makes it rather awkward to write lists IMO. What's the reason for removing line breaks and could this be changed?

[0]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44946386

[charcircuit]

For modern operating systems capturing keyboard input is locked down to avoid keyloggers. Capturing your screen requires explicit user permission to do so, popping up a dialog. Apps are isolated so another app can't interfere and install a browser extention or modify shell configs, etc.

[wltr]

And modern operating systems are being … ? macOS, I assume?

[LtWorf]

Can you name one of these modern operating systems?

[charcircuit]

iOS is a modern operating system.

[LtWorf]

It's also impossible to use it for anything productive.

[aborsy]

The OS protections apply to all applications. In addition, the job of agents like gpg-agent or ssh-agent is to protect secret keys while they are cached (like preventing OS writing keys to swaps). You can configure them to erase keys after a certain time, require user’s confirmation for each key operation, store gpg keys in internal TPM or external hsm, and would talk to the agent through specific sockets.

Unlike browser-based password managers, the agents don’t continuously interact with the browser code and remote elements (probably don’t have network access at all).

One area that matters that I forgot to mention in my comment below is that, as a result of all above, Pass doesn’t check the domains and doesn’t protect against phishing. There might be extensions, but at that point, you might as well use keepassxc.