[Buttons840]

You make some good points.

I guess a "living wage" probably implies living an "normal" American life, which isn't maximally tightening the belt.

Even with good public transportation, driving saves a lot of time. The extra $300 probably comes from a combination of needing to buy a new phone and new computer periodically, hidden taxes and fees, and also it's reasonable to expect a "normal" living wage to include enough to cover at least 2 or 3 of the cheapest options--more than just one single bottom-of-the-barrel option.

Again, you make good points, and I agree some skepticism about their "living wage" numbers are justified. At least they break it down to give a glimpse into some of their logic.

[j_w]

The problem is that the "normal" American consumes greatly beyond their means. What I described isn't maximally tightening the belt, it's a very reasonable and satisfying way to live.

I don't have a car, I ride a bike, walk, or take public transit. In no way do I feel restricted in my daily life. I have a 6 year old iPhone that if you amortize would be $100/year (well under that extra 300).

A lot of Americans would consider no car and an old phone to be untenable. How would I get to work? You live closer to work. It's too expensive to live closer to work. Well is it once you get rid of your car(s)? There are genuinely going to be some areas of the country where this is not possible (living in proximity to work where a car is not needed). But those areas typically do not have a "cost of living crisis."

[Buttons840]

What about needing a laptop for the internet? There's $1000, and you need to upgrade every couple years. I spent $2000 to build a desktop myself 10 years ago; it still works well enough, it plays the games I like, but Windows wont support it anymore, it's end of life; there's $200 a year.

Again, "living" implies a little wiggle room and having access to more than just the one cheapest bottom-of-the-barrel option.

What if you lose your phone? You'll have to buy another. Can we include that potential expense in the budget? A "living" wage implies you're not set back for years because you lost one item.

[j_w]

The living wage calculation on that website does not constitute your last paragraph. I'd argue that not including a savings/retirement investment portion makes it a much worse number.

As for a computer, your desktop will work fine with Linux. A laptop doesn't need to cost 1000, again we are over consuming. If your hobby requires a computer, that would be from recreational expenses, not required technology spending.

Living has lots of wiggle room, but it starts with understanding what you actually NEED vs what you think you need, then wiggling from there. If you start with inflated base monthly expenses your true requirements become obscured.

I'm privileged. I don't actually know what a healthy retirement savings rate is because I'm certainly well above that in my own savings. But part of why I'm well above that is because I truly cut down on a lot of unneeded spending that I see many of my peers doing.

[Buttons840]

A living wage should allow recreation. Gaming is one of the cheapest forms of recreation.

You're also claiming average people should know how to install and use Linux, so I don't know if we can reach further agreement.