[kumarski]

http://www.rizzoma.com is much better.

The founder himself stayed at my place using airbnb this summer. I'm a YC alum. He has one of the most interesting founding stories I've ever heard. He is a Siberian-Kazakhstani hacking competition winner who knows Judo and runs a series of small businesses in Russia. Bars that partake in sportsbetting-all Legal. He designed the software as a way to manage his businesses with his founders and grew it into something more.

[Udo]

That unjustified blanket statement and the tone of your comment just rub me the wrong way.

Who cares how amazingly, mind-blowingly awesome your buddy the founder of Rizzoma is? This thread is about another project, and it's not based on Wave. This is hardly the place where you should walz in and shill for something else without so much as a word about Pivory, let alone some constructive criticism of any kind.

[kumarski]

Sorry Udo.

I wish you the best in building your technology. I will say you've done some pretty cool stuff in the area of UX with the ability to change the fonts and appearance on the fly. I meant no offense.

Again, sorry.

[cheshirecat]

Hi kumarski, your comment is strange. I don't know Udo in any way.

Pivory is a one-man project. I built all the codes and designs by myself (and owe many thanks to the users who were so nice and provided many useful comments - I posted it to /r/programming before this).

I have been coding for 20 years, so it's not that unthinkable. Sometimes the one-man way can be the fastest way. No time wasted in communications. Refactoring is always straightforward.

Rizzoma is 100 times more complicated and I must say: nice work! It covers a completely different market. I can see all the efforts behind it.

[Udo]

WTF, I never said I had anything to do with the project! I was merely making a point about being more supportive towards a Show HN project instead of just linking to a competitor and stating "this is better and the guy running it is awesome".

How can anyone read my comment and infer it's my project? Was my wording really that misleading?!?

[kobzevvv]

Actually yes, rizzoma goes to different market.

BTW I like how Ivory works. Me and other guys from rizzoma team played a couple hours with Ivory. My congratulations for developer!

[smacktoward]

Rizzoma allows communication within a certain context permitting a chat to instantly become a document where topics of a discussion organized into branches of mind-map diagram and minor details are collapsed to avoid distraction.

Because we all know a person who's said to us at one point or another "I wish I had a way to have a chat instantly become a document where topics of discussion are organized into branches of a mind-map diagram."

[83457]

Actually I think that is what a lot of systems are moving towards... a real-time outliner/wiki. I use WorkFlowy with others to manage releases and other information and with just a couple multi-user oriented feature it would match your description. Trello is in this direction as well. Google Wave just felt toooo real-time and free-form.

[saurik]

I believe I know three people who have all said something almost identical to that a little over 10 years ago (I kid you not).

[smacktoward]

You must run with an interesting crowd! :-D

[tensafefrogs]

How is it better? Rizzoma (wave) is so incredibly complicated I feel very overwhelmed when I visit the site. It's like stepping into a fighter jet cockpit.

[d0m]

I agree.. I've just tried it. It took forever to load and when it was loaded, I felt in an ugly wysiwyg editor with buttons and editable fields everywhere. I was troubled and had no idea where to look or click.

I feel that I really didn't give rizzoma a fair tryout but then if the first impression is overwhelming and scary, it's hard to move forward.

I'd suggest cutting all the crap and introduce more complex features over time.. or when it's needed.

[baseh]

Same experience here. I think compared to Ops site, Rizzoma is over-engineered out of the wazoo. Once you start adding features for everyone, their grandma and their dog, things are bound to get complicated. The Ops site is such a simple and a breath of fresh air.

[kobzevvv]

Could you provide links to services that are you talking about?

[kobzevvv]

Actually you right. Rizzoma have too complicated UX. In couple weeks we are going to release new version of our interface and I hope it will much easier in user perception

[webjunkie]

Yet a fighter jet gives you so much power.

[marcamillion]

But requires 20 years of learning to understand how to operate.

[muyuu]

Completely different site with completely different philosophy. I prefer pivory.

For starters I wouldn't log in to a site like this using neither a Facebook account (which I have but it's full of bogus data) or a Google+ account (which I only have because they created it for me, which is when I deleted the little true info about me there).