[zahlman]

In an optical illusion, we perceive something that isn't there due to exploiting a correction mechanism that's meant to allow us to make better practical sense of visual information in the average case.

Asking LLMs to count letters in a word fails because the needed information isn't part of their sensory data in the first place (to the extent that a program's I/O can be described as "sense"). They reason about text in atomic word-like tokens, without perceiving individual letters. No matter how many times they're fed training data saying things like "there are two b's in blueberry", this doesn't register as a fact about the word "blueberry" in itself, but as a fact about how the word grammatically functions, or about how blueberries tend to be discussed. They don't model the concept of addition, or counting; they only model the concept of explaining those concepts.

[rainsford]

I can't take credit for coming up with this, but LLMs have basically inverted the common Sci-Fi trope of the super intelligent robot that struggles to communicate with humans. It turns out we've created something that sounds credible and smart and mostly human well before we made something with actual artificial intelligence.

I don't know exactly what to make of that inversion, but it's definitely interesting. Maybe it's just evidence that fooling people into thinking you're smart is much easier than actually being smart, which certainly would fit with a lot of events involving actual humans.

[throwaway1004]

Very interesting, cognitive atrophy is a serious concern that is simply being handwaved away. Assuming the apparent trend of diminishing returns continues, and LLMs retain the same abilities and limitations we see today, there's a considerable chance that they will eventually achieve the same poor reputation as smartphones and "iPad kids". "Chewing gum for the mind".

Children increasingly speak in a dialect I can only describe as "YouTube voice", it's horrifying to imagine a generation of humans adopting any of the stereotypical properties of LLM reasoning and argumentation. The most insidious part is how the big player models react when one comes within range of a topic it considers unworthy or unsafe for discussion. The thought of humans being in any way conditioned to become such brick walls is frightening.

[griffzhowl]

The sci-fi trope is based on the idea of artificial intelligence as something like an electronic brain, or really just an artificial human.

LLMs on the other hand are a clever way of organising the text outputs of millions of humans. They represent a kind of distributed cyborg intelligence - the combination of the computational system and the millions of humans that have produced it. IMO it's essential to bear in mind this entire context in order to understand them and put them in perspective.

One way to think about it is that the LLM itself is really just an interface between the user and the collective intelligence and knowledge of those millions of humans, as mediated by the training process of the LLM.

[amalcon]

Searle seems to have been right: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_room

(Not that I am the first to notice this either)

[MetaWhirledPeas]

From the wikipedia article:

> applying syntactic rules without any real understanding or thinking

It makes one wonder what comprises 'real understanding'. My own position is that we, too, are applying syntactic rules, but with an incomprehensibly vast set of inputs. While the AI takes in text, video, and sound, we take in inputs all the way down to the cellular level or beyond.

[throwaway1004]

I don't think you're on the right track.

When someone says to me "Can you pass me my tea?", my mind instantly builds a simulated model of the past, present, and future which takes a massive amount of information, going far beyond merely understanding the syntax and intent of the request:

>I am aware of the steaming mug on the table

>I instantly calculate that yes, in fact, I am capable of passing it

>I understand that it is an implied request

>I run a threat assessment

>I am running simulated fluid mechanics to predict the correct speed and momentum to use to avoid harm, visualising several failure conditions I want to avoid (if I'm focused and present)

>I am aware of the consequences of boiling water on skin (I am particularly averse to this because of an early childhood experience, an advantage in my career as a line cook)

>my hands are shaky so I decide to stabilise with my other hand, but I'll have to use the leathery tips of my guitar-playing left hand only, and not for too long, otherwise I'll be scalded

>(enumerable other simulated, predictive processes running in parallel, in the blink of an eye)

"Of course, my pleasure. Would you like milk?"

[pkaodev]

Celebrities, politicians and influencers are a constant reminder that people think others are far more intelligent than they actually are.

[barkingcat]

current gen AI is Pakleds of Star Trek TNG.

Give them a bit of power though, and they will kill you to take your power.

[chromaton]

Moravec strikes again.

[energy123]

The real criticism should be the AI doesn't say "I don't know.", or even better, "I can't answer this directly because my tokenizer... But here's a python snippet that calculates this ...", so exhibiting both self-awareness of limitations combined with what an intelligent person would do absent that information.

We do seem to be an architectural/methodological breakthrough away from this kind of self-awareness.

[spidersouris]

For the AI to say this or to produce the correct answer would be easily achievable with post-training. That's what was done for the strawberry problem. But it's just telling the model what to reply/what tools to use in that exact situation. There's nothing about "self-awareness".

[mike_d]

> But it's just telling the model what to reply/what tools to use in that exact situation.

So the exact same way we train human children to solve problems.

[spidersouris]

There is no inherent need for humans to be "trained". Children can solve problems on their own given a comprehensible context (e.g., puzzles). Knowledge does not necessarily come from direct training by other humans, but can also be obtained through contextual cues and general world knowledge.

[6510]

I keep thinking of that, imagine teaching humans was all the hype with hundreds of billions invested in improving the "models". I bet if trained properly humans could do all kinds of useful jobs.

[exasperaited]

> I keep thinking of that, imagine teaching humans was all the hype

This is an interesting point.

It has been, of course, and in recent memory.

There was a smaller tech bubble around educational toys/raspberry pi/micro-bit/educational curricula/teaching computing that have burst (there's a great short interview where Pimoroni's founder talks to Alex Glow about how the hype era is fully behind them, the investment has gone and now everyone just has to make money).

There was a small tech bubble around things like Khan Academy and MMOCs, and the money has gone away there, too.

I do think there's evidence, given the scale of the money and the excitement, that VCs prefer the AI craze because humans are messy and awkward.

But I also think -- and I hesitate to say this because I recognise my own very obvious and currently nearly disabling neurodiversity -- that a lot of people in the tech industry are genuinely more interested in the idea of tech that thinks than they are about systems that involve multitudes of real people whose motivations, intentions etc. are harder to divine.

That the only industry that doesn't really punish neurodivergence generally and autism specifically should also be the industry that focusses its attention on programmable, consistent thinking machines perhaps shouldn't surprise us; it at least rhymes in a way we should recognise.