[phantompeace]

Some of the people at the top of YC (e.g Garry Tan) are staunch Zionists. Surprisingly, and refreshingly, it seems PG himself sees through all of the bullshit and consistently asks questions to understand why people have become ok with the murders of innocent children. Although I have spoke about this a couple of times in the past, that too is weighing on myself - have I actually done enough? What use are a few social media comments in the grand scheme of things?

[jfengel]

It's actually not too hard to understand. For many Israelis, the October 7 massacre was the final straw after decades of rocket attacks and other forms of terrorism.

As TFA says, Israel blames Hamas. They consider removing Hamas an existential matter, and Hamas is holding the Gazans hostage.

I'm not trying to excuse, merely explain. It is not mere bloodthirst. It is a sincere (if possibly incorrect) belief that Gaza as a whole poses a sufficiently significant threat that civilian deaths -- even babies -- are an acceptable part of waging war.

CAVEAT: the current Israeli government, and a significant fraction of the public, may in fact be that bloodthirsty. Despite everything I just said, many people also hold some kind of religious belief that this land is their destiny, and that they are justified in claiming it by means I can only describe as "Old Testament".

That is not all Israelis; it is likely not a majority. (Elections are next year.) But even Israelis who bitterly oppose this government are sufficiently fearful of Hamas as to justify brutal suppression of all of Gaza.

[phantompeace]

I specifically didn’t mention Israelis or Jews. I’m sure there are plenty of good people in those camps that oppose Netanyahu. I speak about Zionists.

And let’s not pretend history started on October 7th, that region has been in turmoil for almost a century now, so trying to excuse the sniping of children in the head, mass starvation, subjugation of a whole population, straight up ethnic cleansing in this day and age is indefensible no matter what happened. You say you’re not excusing but only explaining but I don’t want to hear any explanation that equates babies as threats that are okay to kill in war. Hamas could’ve dropped a nuke on Tel Aviv and it still wouldn’t excuse sniping innocent children in the head. Did it become okay to liquidate the ghettoised Jews because they struggled for their freedom? They tried to rise up too? They weren’t prepared to lay down without a fight. And where is the outrage against the Israeli government for firing on their own citizens at the festival?

[jfengel]

I don't know what you mean by "Zionists". The term is routinely applied to anyone who isn't actively seeking the destruction of Israel.

To me, the term only applies to the people who sought to establish the state of Israel. That happened in 1947, and all of the people are dead. By that understanding there are no Zionists.

If you're defining Zionists as people with no morals who seek to destroy babies because they like killing babies, I'm sure they exist. Probably dozens of them. But that does not contribute to an understanding of the situation in Israel and Palestine, because not even Netanyahou falls into that category. (And he is undoubtedly a monster and war criminal.)

[dttze]

Cool, now explain what they are doing in the West Bank right now, with overwhelming support from the Israeli population.

[Sabinus]

Slowly taking land, because if they can't have security through a negotiated peace they'll have it by taking more land. It's cynical and harms the negotiated peace process, but the hope for a peace deal is low and falling after the multiple failed deals and good offers.

[NomDePlum]

Under international law (specifically the Fourth Geneva Convention), an occupying power is prohibited from:

- Transferring its own population into occupied territory.

- Destroying property or forcibly displacing residents unless absolutely necessary for military operations.

A more accurate term than "taking" would be "annexed" or even "ethnic cleansing" as they are dispossessing those on the land.

[tastyface]

These short term “solutions” will only lead to more violence and war later on down the line. And Israel will lose the remaining allies it has left.

[mandmandam]

> Surprisingly, and refreshingly, it seems PG himself sees through all of the bullshit and consistently asks questions to understand why people have become ok with the murders of innocent children.

He does, and that was decent.

Still, PG was all aboard with the DOGE machete hacking up government databases to free up tax cuts for the wealthy (and god knows what else). His Twitter has had some truly awful takes lately.