[hinterlands]

The article starts by dismissing scrollsaws as "pretty darn dangerous", but that's a pretty big stretch. They're less dangerous than a sharp kitchen knife. You want to talk to your kids and watch them closely the first couple of times they use it, but you'd be hard-pressed to find any accounts of serious injuries caused by scrollsaws.

This toy doesn't seem bad as a crafts tool that buys you several quiet weekends, but at $250... that's actually more than a miniature desktop scrollsaw (Proxxon 37088).

[bityard]

I don't have direct experience with a scroll saw but I own (well, made) a bandsaw and it's my favorite power tool. There's a lot you can do with it but more importantly, it's incredibly safe: The blade stays in one place and will never jump out at you or throw your workpiece into your abdomen. If you let your mind wander, you might end up with a cut on your finger. But that's about it. It's pretty much impossible to lose your finger to a bandsaw unless you have permanent nerve damage or are doing your woodworking on meth.

[Doxin]

> If you let your mind wander, you might end up with a cut on your finger.

If you let your mind wander you might lob off a finger before the pain signal reaches your brain. Band saws are safe in that they are largely unlikely to do anything unexpected. They are very dangerous in that they seem so safe.

No one is going to messing around with a table saw. The danger is obvious. It's very tempting to be unsafe around a band saw since it seems so safe.

If you want to see some scary stuff go look up how bandsaws are used in slaughterhouses. They'll use them to lob a whole cow in half in under a second. Now imagine what it'll do to a finger while you're looking the other way.

[mauvehaus]

Usually you aren't feeding wood into a bandsaw at the rate they're feeding cows into a bandsaw at a slaughter house though.

Apart from being a complete dunce, the usual way to get cut with a bandsaw is to be feeding with too much uncontrolled force and hitting a soft spot in the wood or running the blade out of the wood.

But yeah, when I'm teaching, the safety talk includes the line "Every piece of meat you see in a butcher shop was from an animal that was cut up with a bandsaw."

If you want to see something truly terrifying, the ones they use to cut up foam are big enough to cut a massive block of foam, and the blade is just a big, continuous band of razor blade.

[Doxin]

> Apart from being a complete dunce

Or growing complacent.

I think we largely agree on the dangers of a bandsaw to be honest. The only disagreement seems to be how likely it is for a skilled operator to fuck up. Which is for sure debatable unless someone drags in statistics, but given the context I still feel like calling a bandsaw safe in the context of a childrens toy is reckless at best.

> If you want to see something truly terrifying, the ones they use to cut up foam are big enough to cut a massive block of foam, and the blade is just a big, continuous band of razor blade.

Yikes, that does sound like the sort of machine I'd not even want to be in the same building with. I sure hope they don't ship those blades coiled up like they do with regular bandsaw blades. You'd need a bomb difusal robot to unpack that safely!

[mauvehaus]

I think being aware of becoming complacent is a really good point. If you're doing a bunch of really repetitive work, it's a good idea to take a break and get your head back in the job at hand rather than letting it wander.

I'm fortunate in that I'm self-employed and get to arrange my work to switch things up as needed. I'm also not usually making a million of anything that would demand doing the same operation for extended periods. I realize that not everyone working in wood has these advantages.

[bityard]

> If you let your mind wander you might lob off a finger before the pain signal reaches your brain.

I'm curious if you have ever used a bandsaw? Woodworking bandsaws just do not cut that fast. It would take multiple seconds of sustained pushing to get through all the meat and bone, it would be very painful and messy. You have a FAR better chance of cutting off your finger with a sharp common kitchen knife than a bandsaw.

[Doxin]

Woodworking band saws will easily cut that fast. Perhaps not through a hard wood, but flesh and bone isn't as tough as a lot of woods. Go have a look at how fast a band saw will cut through an animal carcass. It's VERY quick.

[MadnessASAP]

You've never seen the blade of a bandsaw break? Throwing the blade at you is definitely one of the bandsaws failure modes.

[incanus77]

I saw a classmate push a bandsaw right up between two fingers in eighth grade shop, watching the workpiece and not their hand.

[drewcoo]

> less dangerous than a sharp kitchen knife

Which is less dangerous than a dull kitchen knife.

https://yakushiknives.com/blogs/yakushi-blog-all-thing-knive...

[phyzome]

I've been cut way more often and more seriously with sharp knives than with dull knives.

Everyone says this thing but I suspect it isn't true at all.

[taco_emoji]

Right, I think this is one of those myths that catches hold because it's contrarian and has a grain of truth.

Like I think dull knives are more dangerous than you'd think, but saying they're "more dangerous than sharp knives" is IMO patently false. I've certainly slipped more with dull knives, but... they're dull. They just cannot do as much damage. A dull knife will not take the tip of your finger off. A sharp one will do it before you even feel the pain.

A sharp knife without proper technique is FAR more dangerous.

[citizenpaul]

Yeah I thought it was really cool until I saw the price. Its a toy and costs more than most real tools. I cant help but think everything is a cash grab aimed at the rich nowdays. Maybe it really does cost that much but all I see is some plastic and a <$5 wholesale motor.

[cap11235]

And its cutting cardboard. When I was 12, I used an XActo blade for that, and they are definitely under $10. I don't know exactly prices now because I buy hundred packs of craft blades for like 20. This "product" is silly.

[actionfromafar]

Cutting cardboard in a nice shape is difficult with a knife IMHO.

[hammyhavoc]

> watch them closely the first couple of times they use it

How about every time?

[Cthulhu_]

That would be overbearing and cost you a lot of time. Kids want to do things on their own, they would lose interest if there's someone looming over them all the time.

[hammyhavoc]

So much for parental supervision, huh?

You would be amazed how many kids end up in A&E due to this mentality.

> cost you a lot of time

Welcome to parenting.

[xyzzy123]

Depends on the child and the activity right?

Personally I often prefer to introduce new activities just at the point where I'd feel comfortable leaving them unsupervised (once they've learned it).

A major goal of parenting is to guide your children to independence. This is a sort of negotiation between you, reality and the child. While it can be heartbreaking when they come to you with injuries, you can't watch them all the time (and it's not healthy to try).

If you introduce an activity "too early" such that you always have to supervise, it has some advantages for child but can quickly become a drain on you (they want to do that $thing again but you have other stuff to do) and they feel less independent because they always need your help to do it.

What our family looks out for a lot is "cliff edges". This is where an activity or situation has a high / unreasonable risk vs benefit, and the harm happens quickly and is surprising. These require special attention. Once kids know where the "cliff edges" are they can explore more safely.