[PaulHoule]

Old cars are even like that in performance. My son and I just bought a 1979 Ford Thunderbird which has a 5ℓ V8 engine but doesn't accelerate as well as a modern compact with a 1.5ℓ Inline 4.

It is simple though, it doesn't have a lot of complex parts to repair.

[asciimov]

My family had a '79 Thunderbird that was our main driver from 91-97. I haven't seen any of them on the road in over a decade. I have several memories of that car.

- The water pump going out, as we drove up a mountain, and rolling back down into the drive way of a converted apple barn. Where we found a nice cleaning lady who took my dad the 20 miles into town to get a new water pump, which he replaced in that driveway and got us back on the road.

- The rear diff throwing a bearing well after midnight in the middle of nowhere west Texas. The car limped a few miles down the road to a surprisingly still open gas station. My uncle, a mechanic, happened to have the necessary parts to fix it on him. So when he picked my dad up an hour later, they went ahead and spent the rest of the overnight hours replacing it in the parking lot of that middle of nowhere gas station.

- Spending several days at various salvage yards looking for rear tail lights. They are just the right height to be taken out by shopping carts. Unfortunately the 79 is the only year that didn't have a connecting strip that goes between the left and right hand sides. In the 90's they were very hard to find, I can't imagine they are any easier today. Seriously, buy an extra set even if you don't need them.

If you ever want a to move to a modern V8, Ford's panther platform from '02-'11 are just as big, roomy, and easy to work on as that Thunderbird. Plus you'll get modern conveniences like anti-lock breaks, air-bags, and good part availability.

[rograndom]

Ha! I had one of those in the late 90's. My father had it first and I inherited it when he passed. A couple of months after he bought it, I bought a 1985 LTD, which was basically a 4 door Mustang GT. He asked me if I wanted to race, I said it wouldn't be close. He said "Both cars have the same engine." Yeah, not quite. The Thunderbird had like 120hp, no fuel injection and bogged down to meet emissions, while the LTD had close to 200hp and was several hundred pounds lighter. Another person up the street had the same vintage Thunderbird with the 350ci and had done some work to it. That one went pretty good.

[userbinator]

That sounds like it needs a tune-up. Lots of performance parts available too for cars from that era.

[floren]

These old cars can be a lot of fun but even the fast ones weren't that fast when taken against a modern family car... take a 68 Mustang, an iconic car as featured in Bullitt, with a 0-60 of 5.4 seconds and compare it to a 2012 Toyota Camry doing the same in 5.8 seconds.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparison-test/a151426...

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a15122183/toyota-camry-...

I used to drive a 62 Studebaker. People saw an old car and asked me if it was fast. Hell no, I'd answer -- but by God it can suck fuel!

[flomo]

Here's the thing. A 68 Mustang had no almost emissions controls. A 78 Thunderbird was almost the exact same stuff, except it was choked to shit. A modern computer-controlled Camry is not only way better performing, it also orders of magnitude cleaner.

IMO the ICE has achieved its final form, so now the future has to be something else (electric).

[Reubachi]

RE: "ice final form"

It's an intersting time to live, we are indeed seeing the peak of ICE, though I think there are lots of room for improvement in EGR, compression, more efficient catalytic process.

"smaller market" ICE manufacturers IE isuzu, mazda, hino etc. are sort of working towards this, as opposed to jumping on EV train.

Theoretically, it's completely reasonable for a high compression inlne 3 cylinder with aero wheels/tires to get 60-70 MPG. (With proper EGR, turbo application, CVT)

[PaulHoule]

I think the major carmakers aren't interested in super-economy ICE cars.

They're attracted to XXXXL EVs because they can make the XXXXL cars they want to make and still claim they're "green"

[userbinator]

https://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/94-caprice-wagon-...

50mpg from a 5.7L V8, using most of the drivetrain from a truck(!)

My daily driver gets roughly half that, but it has a carbureted 6.6L and an automatic transmission, with some mild performance tuning done. I am satisfied enough with that.

[flomo]

Really none of that is improving the ICE.

[flomo]

I'd guess it was always a malaise-era smogdog, the same engine from a decade later was much better.

[WalterBright]

I enjoy my 72 Dodge, because I know what every part in it does.

[dgfitz]

Wholeheartedly agree. I’ll leave this here.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44422763

“ I do a lot of work on my own vehicles. I think a lot of the responses are from people who do not. Paying for vehicle repair labor is basically a tax. They're making it harder and harder to fix your own car. I spent the afternoon yesterday trying to find headlight assemblies that didn't need to be coded to work correctly. Headlights. All the outrage about right-to-repair around here, and nobody realizes the frog is almost boiled around repairing cars.”

[linguae]

I’d love to have a project car that I could work on, particularly something simple like a classic Volkswagen Beetle or maybe something more complex but still manageable like a 1980s BMW, but one significant challenge I have (and many other would-be car hobbyists) is being able to afford housing where I’m not subject to lease/HOA restrictions or even local ordinances prohibiting at-home repairs. These restrictions are understandable, especially when considering liability, insurance, and dangers such as the improper storage and disposal of chemicals such as oil. However, this means there isn’t much of a workaround for paying for labor at a mechanic, which has become costly.

During my adult life thus far I’ve only lived in apartments, and every apartment that I’ve rented has a lease clause prohibiting car maintenance and repairs except for very simple tasks such as replacing windshield wipers. Thus, I drive newer cars that don’t require many repairs, and I pay a mechanic whenever I need to perform maintenance or repairs, which costs a lot of money, especially in the Bay Area (the mechanic needs to pay for two places: the rent/mortgage for the shop and also for the mechanic’s residence). Being able to afford a house with a garage and no HOA will require me to either become rich or move out of the Bay Area.

Paying for labor is indeed a heavy tax, but unfortunately thanks to lease/HOA restrictions and sometimes local ordinances, this tax is unavoidable, short of giving up driving.

[WalterBright]

I understand where you're coming from. I've lived in apartments with no garage, and just went ahead and did repairs in the parking lot anyway. But you cannot do major repairs that way. One huge problem is your tools will get stolen if you go back into your apartment to get something. It's all rather unpleasant.

But there are places in Seattle where you can rent a garage and the tools you need, for people in your situation. But I doubt it is cheap.