[Centigonal]

> the leadership has been repeatedly chanting "Death To America" for its 45 year history

This is a good read: https://www.mypersiancorner.com/death-to-america-explained-o...

The phrase is ugly, but it's how you say "fuck the US government" in a very melodramatic and poetic language where the most common way of calling your friend's baby cute translates to "let me martyr myself for this child."

[jfengel]

I am not an expert in the language or the culture, so I'm willing to accept that as the truth.

Nonetheless... they've had 45 years to figure out what it sounds like to us. Those 45 years started with actual violence, and has continued with various forms of proxy conflict. So I don't think it's 100% on us to de-escalate the situation.

(That said... they had been working on that de-escalation, and we're the ones who threw that in the bin about a decade ago. So I'd say the burden has shifted substantially back in our direction.)

[porridgeraisin]

The reason you guys threw it in the bin is here:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mossad_infiltration_of_Irani...

[jfengel]

We withdrew because of information that was already 15 years out of date?

I'd understand if it showed that Iran was failing to live up to the JCPOA. But to withdraw based on what it had been doing back in 1999-2003, a decade before the agreement? That, I can't follow.

[porridgeraisin]

> I'd understand if it showed that Iran was failing to live up to the JCPOA

But it does show that, from the wiki:

According to journalist Yonah Jeremy Bob and nuclear expert Jeffrey Lewis, much of the key contents were already reported in past IAEA reports. However, the trove provided more clarity about Iran's specific goals for its arsenal,[12] and it proved that Iran violated the JCPOA, which prohibited Iran from engaging in any research and development activity and required full disclosure of all of Iran's nuclear program, including documentation

> can't follow

Actually it is hard to follow! Both governments made it as if because the evidence was found, US withdrew from the pact. However, the operation to gather the evidence was launched so as to give the US a valid reason to withdraw from the pact. The cause-effect is the other way around. Of course, everyone suspected that Iran wasn't keeping up the promise with or without evidence anyways. The evidence was needed solely to give the US president a political reason to dump a deal set by his predecessor.