[HideousKojima]

Well their top directorial talent is retired (and even if it's another fake retirement like his last two, he's too old to do too much more) or dead. Miyazaki's films seem to be more popular and well known than Takahata's (personally Grave of the Fireflies and The Cat Returns are the only Takahata films I've seen), but both men were the heart of the studio. Goro Miyazaki has improved since his debut but is still nowhere as talented nor as visionary as his father.

Also The Boy and the Heron was quite a letdown for me for Miyazaki's final film. I understood the point he was trying to make, that the films he made were his attempt at creating a perfect world, but the malice in his own heart made him unable to accomplish his vision. But the rest of the film didn't really seem to be built around that message, it seemed like an afterthought for the final scenes where the great-uncle is trying to pass the mantle on to him.

In any case, Princess Mononoke is my favorite film of all time, and the closest that Miyazaki (and Studio Ghibli) ever got to perfection. If you haven't seen it you should absolutely check it out.

[timr]

> personally Grave of the Fireflies and The Cat Returns are the only Takahata films I've seen

You owe it to yourself to watch the Tale of Princess Kaguya (かぐや姫の物語). It might be his best film, and quite possibly one of the best ever produced by Ghibli.

Takahata was robbed of the Oscar that year which went to...Big Hero. Ugh.

Between Kaguya and Grave of the Fireflies, Takahata had two of the best films ever made, in any category, and never got an Oscar.

[hedora]

I know the Oscars are prestigious, but I can’t think of a single film in my top fifty favorites that won one.

For me, they are a contrarian indicator.

[fakedang]

Oscar judges don't watch the movies they judge. They usually just ask their children about them, or go by general "vibes" or choose by which one has more "diversity", etc.

https://variety.com/2025/film/awards/oscars-viewing-requirem...

[nottorp]

Grave of the fireflies can be described as depressing Oscar bait.

I believe the reason Miyazaki's movies are so popular is because there is at least hope in them.

[hedora]

I think that’s unfair; it’s semi-autobiographical

[timr]

It's based on a short story published by Akiyuki Nosaka [1] which was based on his own experiences, and in general, the fate of many children after the war [2].

As far as I can tell, the movie was a faithful re-enactment of the story, which itself was only slightly removed from the author's own experiences. War is fundamentally depressing, and the only thing you could reasonably call "oscar bait" was the choice to make the movie at all. Others might call it brave -- particularly when you realize that it was released at the same time as Totoro. The brilliance of the film was that it used "kids animation" to portray the misery of war in a way that I don't think any other movie ever has.

It was a fundamental re-imagining of the scope of the medium, and the deep irony of a comment like the GP is that the entire reason it gets dismissed is because it pushes the boundaries of animation far beyond what is usually deemed acceptable.

Miyazaki plays metaphorical footsie with themes like death and pain and obligation -- and maybe he's more successful because of it -- but Takahata just takes them head-on.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grave_of_the_Fireflies_(short_...

[2] https://thoughtmight.com/movie/grave-of-the-fireflies-misinf...

[nottorp]

Sure. So?

Are you next going to tell me it’s not the kind of movie that gets festival prizes?

And deny me the right to be tired of this kind of movie?

Besides you ignored that i was hypothesising why the Miyazaki movies are more popular in your rush the defend the depressing masterpiece.

[pimeys]

It's either Totoro, Princess Mononoke, Spirited Away, Lauputa, or Kiki's Delivery Service for me. Depending on the phase of the moon.

But yeah, there are not many directors like Miyazaki or Kubrick left.

Maybe I could count Céline Sciamma to the same company. I wish she would make a new movie soon.

[pcthrowaway]

Nausicaa for me, I feel like that movie is criminally underrated among his catalog.

Totoro is certainly a close second though.

[GuB-42]

Is it really underrated? That's a shame then.

Nausicaa is my favorite for several reasons. It may also be the most significant as it is technically not a Ghibli but the movie that lead to the creation of the studios.

[HideousKojima]

I thought Nausicaa was ok, but I'd read the entire manga before ever watching the film snd the changes from the manga were just too drastic for me.

[yazantapuz]

Porco Rosso is my favorite Ghibli/Miyazaki film.

[onetokeoverthe]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Balconettes

2024.

She's been at it nearly 20 years. True creativity has limits.

[pimeys]

Should put that to my watchlist. The trio of Tomboy, Girlhood, and Portrait of a Lady on Fire are some of my all time favorite movies.

[chucky_z]

As I've gotten older, I have grown to understand that while a lot of these films are popular for good reason (and are extremely good!) some of the best films, objectively to me, are some of the 'quietier' ones.

I'd say that Up On Poppy Hill is probably my partner and I's favorite Ghibli film. It's 'small' and 'quiet' in that the scope is a single town, and there's nothing super fantastical about it. Every time I watch it I see and hear something new. This is definitely Goro's best film as a director at Ghibli.

The film that hit me the hardest though is The Wind Rises. If you are a married man this is a film that will absolutely effect you emotionally. There are some films that are targeted as extremely specific audiences and this is one of those. I think everyone can enjoy it, but there's a handful of scenes that are so specific that I connected with so directly that I could feel every moment that Miyazaki was trying to convey at that exact time.

There's another film that is definitely more biased to adults, that is Only Yesterday. It's probably the slowest paced film that Ghibli has made, however it's one that's stuck with me so thoroughly. Especially the final few scenes, which only when they're over do you realize was something like 15-20 minutes with maybe a handful of dialogue lines. This is also another non-Miyazaki film that is extremely good.

[CobaltFire]

I completely agree. I adore the Ghibli classics, but the three you mentioned are my personal favorites for much the same reason.

[Magi604]

Mononoke is also my favorite film. It's also (imo) one of the few animes that is equally good both in sub and dub.

[echelon]

> Mononoke is also my favorite film.

How are there that many of us? It really is a spectacular film.

> equally good both in sub and dub.

The dub has decent voice acting, but is plagued with changing the meaning of several scenes. Kaya is Ashitaka's little sister, not betrothed. They inserted fart jokes. Moro's voice is significantly different [1]. Also, Neil Gaiman was involved in the localization. I've never been a fan of his.

There was also a really great anecdote about Miyazaki winning out over Harvey Weinstein [2]. "No Cuts!"

Back when I was a kid, I bought Miramax's old Princess Mononoke marketing site [3]. I still have it floating around, I think.

[1] https://www.out.com/film/2022/8/24/meet-japanese-drag-queen-...

[2] https://www.youtube.com/shorts/f4BgE1kdTGQ

[3] http://www.princess-mononoke.com/ (not SSL, whoops!)

[justsomehnguy]

> They inserted fart jokes

Whaaa? Can you provide any details?

The fondness of Americans of anything butt-related is well known but this is something penultimate.

[xdavidliu]

i also was surprised at this and don't exactly remember one, but i were to guess, its one of the scenes of Jigo (short squat guy in sandals) eating porridge and laughing too hard maybe?

[echelon]

It's at the introduction of Ashitaka, Eboshi, Toki, and Gonza at Iron Town. They used it to add levity to the situation, I guess? It was entirely pointless and stupid.

edit: Actually, it was from the scene with Eboshi, Gonza, and the women talking about the threat from the emperor around the 1:17:00 - 1:18:00 mark. Right before Ashitaka wakes up in the cave and talks with Moro. It's comedic effect to get the women to laugh at the supposedly-tough Gonza.

It's meant to be either a fart or someone blowing a raspberry, but none of the characters mouths are moving. I think it's clearly meant to be the former.

I just watched the English and the Japanese versions and only the English dub has it.

I need to watch this again. It's such a good movie.

[justsomehnguy]

Oof

I don't think I have the willpower to check it myself, I never ever saw it it in the US dub - and I don't think I want to. But thanks for the clarification.

> I need to watch this again. It's such a good movie.

I recently just threw the whole of Art Of Mononoke Hime to my wallpaper folder, and it's a treat. May I indulge you for the same?

https://archive.org/details/artof-mononoke/ArtofMononoke_013...

[arduanika]

How is it penultimate? Did you mean a different word?

[justsomehnguy]

    a:    Next to last. 

Inserting a fart joke when it wasn't in the source is quite low. But there are even more lower hanging things the American distribution did, so it's not the ultimate for sure.

[HideousKojima]

The dub is good, but Moro's Japanese voice actor makes the subs superior every time.

[wodenokoto]

Cat return isn't directed by Takahata. Neither is the predecessor Whisper of the Heart, so I'm not sure which film you are thinking of, or if you've only ever watched one of his films.

I agree that The Boy and Heron wasn't a very good film. It honestly felt like an imitation.

[HideousKojima]

For some reason my brain was remembering The Cat Returns as being directed by him, my bad