[maeil]

The title does not do the content justice. Since Snowden it's been known to the entire world, even outside of HN, that the US government has had this capability for decades now, with mass dragnet surveillance of all internet traffic.

What has changed is that now they're actually using this to a degree that even China generally does not do. If a German had written a comment in support of the Hong Kong protests on Facebook at some point in time, they're extremely unlikely to get denied entry to China over this, despite them almost certainly having even stronger capabilities and databases to easily find this out.

[WarOnPrivacy]

> that the US government has had this capability for decades now, with mass dragnet surveillance of all internet traffic.

This is an important point.

The Bush admin established systems to surveil ~everyone in the US (not suspected of a crime) in bulk. Bulk surveillance is the well known, core component of systems intended to harm people (in bulk).

This got a pass from Bush supporters (inc me at first). It got little-to-no strong pushback elsewhere.

The Obama admin massively expanded Bush era surveillance systems. This got a pass from nearly everyone (excepting a period after the Edward Snowden revelations).

Not holding a reasonable PotUS accountable - this gifts power to the unreasonable ones that follow.

[mandmandam]

> The Obama admin massively expanded Bush era surveillance systems. This got a pass from nearly everyone.

Obama's first campaign ran on him opposing warrantless wiretapping and blanket immunity for telecoms. He also unequivocally condemned torture, promised to revise/sunset the Patriot Act, copperfasten Roe v Wade 'Day 1', etc...

But virtually all the Democrats I knew didn't give a single shit when he 180'd on all of that in his first few months. Still blows my mind a bit to this day; a marvel of mass brainwashing.

Now we're at the point where Democrats can arm and enable a literal holocaust inflicted on some of the world's poorest and most beautiful people, then get on a high horse when someone suggests voting for a non-genocidal party.

The ratchet effect is beyond extreme; and quite obvious for observant people with an outside perspective. Yet somehow Americans still seem to have hope that voting Dem hard enough will fix things. I wish I knew what it would take to inflict a sense of morality on the country.

[WarOnPrivacy]

> Obama's first campaign ran on him opposing warrantless wiretapping and blanket immunity for telecoms

That's what I thought.

What I recall more clearly: He and Clinton both pausing their 2008 PotUS election campaigns to return to DC and vote in favor of granting retroactive immunity to AT&T.

[tremon]

What Obama ran on and what he actually did are two completely separate things.

[mandmandam]

Yes, that was the thrust of the comment; but the bigger point was that most Democrats really didn't seem to mind.

The 'team sport' character of US politics has separated Americans from even the most widely agreed on objective morality; torture, mass spying, arming and enabling genocide, bailing out banks and polluters, etc.

[Spooky23]

Snowden showed that the tools were available to intelligence agencies operating under questionable rules. Now the coordination of those agencies is led by a Russian agent, and poorly trained keystone cops have access, courtesy of Palantir.

Also note that the IRS and Social Security data is protected and access is a serious crime. So the responsible Feds are long fired or resigned.

[WarOnPrivacy]

> Also note that the IRS and Social Security data is protected and access is a serious crime. So the responsible Feds are long fired or resigned.

The access was given to Palantir. Your statement is dismissive in a way that suggests this dangerous situation no longer exists.

Are you asserting that Palantir no longer has access to this data?

[Spooky23]

No, im suggesting that what Palantir is illegal, the IRS and Social Security staff bullied into allowing it are likely felonies on providing it to the company.

My statement was confusing. The employees who were responsible stewards of this data have either been fired or resigned in protest.