[mgkimsal]

Carl and Dennis both grew in to good songwriters, in different ways, but neither were close to being able to work with Brian in those early years. By the time they could, Brian seemed to be largely gone. Had they had all that combined talent together functioning at the same time, things would have turned out different (and ideally better).

[parpfish]

... now say something nice about mike.

[tpmoney]

I’ll take a shot. Even the worst accounts of the events between him and the various other members over the years seem to me to demonstrate that he was the most involved in keeping the “Beach Boys” (in whatever form) alive and relevant. My reading on things is he was largely responsible for booking and pushing the touring they did, for keeping them in the public eye and doing what he could to keep their catalog in rotation. Without Mike, my guess is The Beach Boys would be another in a line of brilliant but burned out groups, scattered and broken by Brian’s mental illness and related issues from what the other Wilson’s were also dealing with. We will probably never know the full story but it’s notable to me that all of the members at various points remained involved with him and the work he was doing under The Beach Boys name. There are a lot of groups that have split and never worked together again for true bad blood, and that didn’t happen here, whatever else has.

[mgkimsal]

Good points.

[mgkimsal]

I can if you really want...

I do think Mike contributed over the years, possibly more in the early days just through enthusiasm and perhaps helping to focus. I think he was probably more willing to go along with some corny showbiz stuff than Brian was, and being older than the others, that probably carried enough weight to get the others to go along (again, in the early days).

I think being family was probably helpful. He could sympathize enough and support the others dealing with Murray in the early days, but was enough of an 'outsider' that he wasn't going to be bullied by Murray like the sons were.

Lyrically, I think he tries, and has had some moments of good or great lyrics. His push towards the spiritual led us to songs like 'All This Is That', for example (based on readings stemming from time with Maharishi). I wonder how much of the initial push towards the Maharishi was maybe riding the Beatles' coattails, but he seems to have stuck with it more than many over the years. As with many folks who get a lot of sudden fame/success, he was probably searching for deeper answers, and seems to have found some.

Personality wise, based on enough interviews, he does seem to come across as a bit of an arrogant know-it-all, and that rubs me the wrong way. But... he contributed a lot to early success, has had some of his own good songs, and has kept the music alive touring longer than many expected.

Interesting comparison about production/songcraft. Listen to his solo version of 'daybreak over the ocean', then listen to the 'Beach Boys' production version from That's Why God Made the Radio album. Assuming Brian had some production hand in the latter (along with others in the studio), but the BB one is simply a better listening experience, even though it's basically the same song. So even when Mike did something good, the "group" made it better.

[parpfish]

Thorough.

Might as well keep it going: Any thoughts on Al? I assume he always felt like a bit of an outsider because he was the only non-family member

[mgkimsal]

I've always been intrigued with him - had hoped to meet him at a concert years ago, but didn't happen. To be complete, I guess David Marks was an outsider too, although living across the street(?) he was probably 'closer' to the family for a time than Al was.

He's always struck me as just a basic down to earth guy. That may be in comparison to the rest of the group members and their antics.

His voice has remained remarkably strong and good. He was by far the best voice when I saw him on Brian's tour in 2016, and was good (on the couple songs he got?) on the 2012 tour. I don't think his solo songwriting is all that great, but he focuses on what he does and does it well.

I suspect he's got some good behind the scenes stories that would break a lot of myths, and I also suspect he'll never tell all.