[vasusen]

(disclosure: I am no longer at Coursera)

When Duolingo added that viral post on Growth hacking, it caused quite a stir about the push-notifications and gamification tactics they use. Ultimately, we decided it wasn't worth it for Coursera to veer into edu-tainment.

However, it is interesting to watch how much gamification works in adding and retaining users. In 2023, Duolingo's marketcap was 5x of Coursera. Now at similar revenue it is 20x of Coursera.

As a user, I think Duolingo is over-gamified (stopped using it) but Coursera is severely on the other spectrum where it comes off as too bland/boring to keep up the motivation. I am sure there's a happy medium to be found between reminding users to engage in something hard while doing right by learners.

[hintymad]

> In 2023, Duolingo's marketcap was 5x of Coursera

Maybe this is because Coursera requires a lot more effort? My pessimistic view is that most people do not like learning, let alone learning in their leisure time with their own bucks. On the other hand, Duolingo gives more people the false impression that it's easy to learn a new language. And check out their math and chess program. They are really really easy, like pre-school level easy. Naturally, more people would be using Duolingo.

[ChrisMarshallNY]

> My pessimistic view is that most people do not like learning, let alone learning in their leisure time with their own bucks.

Sadly, I have come to the same conclusion.

I have been training and giving seminars for ages. I don’t think that I’m the world’s best teacher, but I’m not that bad.

Geeks can be fun to teach, because they actually enjoy learning. It’s really a fundamental requirement for our industry.

Non-geeks; not so much. I often try to teach non-geeks how to do some small thing (usually around using tech). They almost always basically tell me that they don’t want to learn. Instead, they want me to do it for them.

There are definitely geeks that have leveraged this, to become fairly wealthy, but I find it kind of depressing.

[smcin]

> Geeks can be fun to teach, because they actually enjoy learning... Non-geeks; not so much.

I think it's nowhere near as simple or binary as that... there's a whole individual(/group) psychology of useful gamification, it's not all dark patterns. I found this out before and during Covid when me and five people I know were trying to gamify our motivation for exercise/weight loss/daily steps/cardio/toning; then 2020 and Covid set fire to the entire field. Exercise/weight loss are obviously different to learning CS, but here's what I learned:

- some people like to set a private individual goal and measure their individual progess towards it, even(/especially) if outsiders can't see what it is ("X has 45% progress toward their weight-loss goal and 56% toward their cardio goal.")

- ...or just directly quote times for e.g. 1 mile run, 4 mile walk etc.

- some people love the social-media/blogging aspect of sharing within a defined group photos or daily diary of their activity. MyFitnessPal's social features

- some people like taking the drudgery or loneliness out of solo exercise, such as listening to audiobooks/podcasts, or apps like 'Zombies, Run!' or 'The Outbreak' which turn your walks into a survival adventure.

- some people like the leaderboard or group dynamic of smack-talk or one-upping their friends (e.g. Stridekick app, but it's $ beyond the free intro period, and it has terrible power consumption)

- some people like setting food/drink reward goals: walk/run/row/ski X miles to earn a beer/burger/donut/etc.

- apps like Strava are for hardcore athletes in a single sport, not suited to the general public, you can't say "This week I want to burn Y,000 calories" then achieve that that multimodally across walking, workout, fitness class, dance, running/cycling, swimming, carrying shopping home etc.

- some people really like a shared goal e.g. "this week our group will walk 25,000 steps"

- some people like the daily nag/reminder/motivator to (configurable) do their walk after lunch, evening workout etc. (smartphone/bracelet/watch knows when you've done them), or not break a streak

- some people like to motivate by donating (or wagering) for a good cause if they do/don't meet your goals/beat their partner

- I forget the name of the app that each week partnered you up with a different stranger and you had to try to beat them (Challenges/Strive/?)

- Fooducate is good for gaming nutrition and shopping, and has freemium add-ons for specific diet/exercise plans

- some people (esp. the smartwatch brigade) like measuring how exercise and diet affect/improve sleep quality

- and so on.

[cgio]

The leverage from revenue to market cap can mean a few different things. Duolingo may be overvalued, coursera undervalued, or both. In any case, the impact of gamification on revenue would be a better indicator of its direct efficiency. The rest is just creative charts on a slide.