[kukkeliskuu]

Around 20 years ago I was working for a database company. During that time, I attended SIGMOD, which is the top conference for databases.

The keynote speaker for the conference Stonebraker, who started Postgres, among other things. He talked about the history of relational databases.

At that time, XML databases were all the rage -- now nobody remembers them. Stonebraker explained that there is nothing new in the hierarchical databases. There was a significant battle in SIGMOD, I think somewhere in the 1980s (I forget the exact time frame) between network databases and relational databases.

The relational databases won that battle, as they have won against each competing hierarchical database technology since.

The reason is that relational databases are based on relational algebra. This has very practical consequences, for example you can query the data more flexibly.

When you use JSON storage such as MongoDB, when you decide your root entities you are stuck with that decision. I see very often in practice that there will always come new requirements that you did not foresee that you then need to work around.

I don't care what other people use, however.

[kwillets]

Stonebraker is one of the few whose criticism is listened to. He recently updated his "What goes around comes around" paper; it's worth a read:

https://db.cs.cmu.edu/papers/2024/whatgoesaround-sigmodrec20...

[threeseed]

MongoDB is a $2b/year revenue company growing at 20% y/y. JSON stores are not going anywhere and it's an essential tool for dealing in data where you have no control over the schema or you want to do it in the application layer.

And the only "battle" is one you've invented in your head. People who deal in data for a living just pick the right data store for the right data schema.

[kukkeliskuu]

"Battle" was (if I remember correctly) the term used by Stonebraker in his 2001 SIGMOD keynote to describe what happened at that specific SIGMOD in the 1980s. It is not "only in my head". Like I said, I don't care what other people store data in.

I don't think MongoDB is going anywhere on the medium term, and there is always going to be some customers. Just like the network databases in the 70s, or XML databases in the 90s.

Bad ideas never die, they just resurface in another form, which people label as "new".

https://db.cs.cmu.edu/papers/2024/whatgoesaround-sigmodrec20...

[pragmatic]

And sql server alone is like 5 billion/yr.

[threeseed]

Almost like there is room in the market for more than just SQL databases.

[lazide]

Sensitive much?

[icedchai]

I find using Postgres and JSONB often gets me the best of both worlds.

[znpy]

Ah yes MongoDB, it's web-scale!