[caprock]

I've found a lot of value in the habits of politeness, especially in written communication. It's disappointing when it's not a first class citizen in a company culture for things like code review. There are plenty of rationalizations for how it might not be needed, but that just feels like laziness.

[robocat]

I personally prefer to be given brutal honesty. Overly polite people often annoy me because they hide information or they can't get to the point or their point is hidden within layers of wishy-washy mush that I need to correctly parse and then respond correctly to.

Politeness is absolutely necessary, and I hate seeing callous impoliteness in wider society (e.g. towards service workers).

I suspect I would severely struggle in a deeply polite society (stereo-typically Asian?). I can relax the most around very direct people (Dutch?).

I am continually stressed when dealing with anyone that absolutely needs politeness. Example 1: a very close friend who can be triggered by anything reminding them of their abusive ex. Example 2: a self-centred acquaintance that needs pandering (however isn't polite in return).

There's a balance - but it's hard to find. Perhaps I'm confusing two different dimensions, politeness and honesty?

Edit: This is a wishy-washy comment. Difficult topic, straight-jacketed conflict, interpersonal stuff that is hard to understand and talk about.

[cduzz]

I think that "polite" and "honest" and "direct" are orthogonal.

It is possible to be direct, honest, and polite.

You should consider the possibility that you're mistaken in linking "rude" with "direct"

[Jensson]

> I think that "polite" and "honest" and "direct" are orthogonal.

They are certainly correlated so not orthogonal, its much harder to not be rude when you communicate a complaint than with praise.

You need to put much more effort in when you complain about something to not be seen as rude, that means they are not orthogonal. It also means many will just not do it since its too much work.

[pbh101]

Or it means you haven’t practiced and some parts of the space are more difficult for you to traverse individually but still orthogonal objectively. I would say that something isn’t orthogonal if it is impossible to be both. It is clearly possible, just not practiced or easy.

I could grant there is also an objective friction surface, a fourth scalar describing how difficult it is to be direct, honest, and polite at once.

[cj]

I feel similarly about overly-agreeable people, or people who bend over backwards to do everything in their power to make sure everyone around them likes them.

For me, it stems from seeing when someone changes their behavior or words in a way that's no longer authentic to themselves. I like when people are real with me.

But being real or authentic also isn't an excuse to be a jerk.

[jimbokun]

Being polite and being direct simultaneously can be tricky to realize but not impossible. The best communicators manage to achieve both.

[notepad0x90]

I think you can be polite and direct, but at the cost of being verbose and awkward.

[pbh101]

If you see someone do it well (the word ‘genteel’ comes to mind) you can find that verbos it and awkwardness will detract from both the directness and honesty.

‘Traditional’ etiquette books are actually pretty good at this stuff: one definition of etiquette is to never out another ill at ease or uncomfortable. Discomfort is contagious especially through body language, so the first thing you must do is be comfortable yourself with the feedback you’re giving.

[dtpro20]

I don't have time for the overly polite fluff talk to the expense of practical and real communication. It is hard to be caring and direct. Being triggered by anything can be ptsd, and/or a self defense mechanism for incompetence, so it's important to work out what is going on in these cases. But yes, it is absolutely possible to be caring and gracious while still being direct when you exclude the people who will over react as a self defense mechanism as a result of valid or invalid reasons.