[mijoharas]

Unfortunately no.

I believe the reason for this is that the risk of chargebacks for adult content is much higher, so the card networks need to pay more to service these merchants and it's less profitable for them (or maybe in some cases unprofitable).

Essentially it just comes down to the bottom line.

[stickfigure]

> the risk of chargebacks for adult content is much higher

Stop repeating this as if it is true.

[qingcharles]

It is absolutely not true. The chargeback rate is incredibly low. People just parrot that line.

[throwaway290]

This is actually easy to debunk.

Timing. MasterCard/Visa ditched Pornhub subs the same month after the story about csam went public. It had nothing to do with chargebacks.

Then they also ditched Pornhub advertisement company. Not relevant to chargebacks.

Read https://www.reuters.com/business/finance/mastercard-visa-sus... for how it went down.

And of course big adult sites including Pornhub are not stupid enough to use anything mentioning "porn" on bank statements.

And if you talk to actual programmers working in adult industry you will learn payment processors have special strict rules for adult industry. Literally because of moral standards. See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24291790 where it is discussed.

So no. It was not about chargebacks, it's about making money from child rape videos. Some people have values. Corporations are run by people who have to face their kids and spouses.

[aleph_minus_one]

> I believe the reason for this is that the risk of chargebacks for adult content is much higher

Why do you think this is the case?

[mijoharas]

Sorry a very fair question. This is due to an article I read a fair while back asserting that. Let me see if I can find it or similar. Ok here is an HN comment (relevant section extracted from comment[0], full thread[1]) with some discussion on that.

> In the adult/porn world, there's a high amount of chargebacks and fraud relative to low-risk industries like SaaS software. If you pass a certain chargeback threshold in the adult industry, your account is terminated, and no payment processor will do business with you.

Now it was ages ago that I read this, and I'm sure it's a more nuanced topic than my simplified answer, but that's what I understood from my reading at the time.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24294801

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24291790

[throwaway290]

If you read your own sources, the thread your linked, the stories shared by people working in that industry make it super clear that the root cause is that payment processors are allergic to adult industry (ie porn) not higher chargeback risk. They specifically set low chargeback tolerance just for this industry. So how can you deny that it is about people's ethics and values. Of people who run corporations and people who are willing to sue them.

And it was ethics and values for Pornhub too. See my other comment or just look up what happened.

[brookst]

People buy porn; spouses see credit card bills; people are performatively outraged and say it must be fraud.

[chownie]

The classic example case is "honey, I don't know what this charge on our monthly expenses is I promise, look I'll charge it back" — ie cover up for an angry spouse.

[throwaway290]

What you and mijoharas allude to is a cute urban myth. Pornhub never appeared as Pornhub on your bank statements and the same goes for every serious adult content site for decades. And if it was about chargebacks Visa would never even touch Amazon or AliExpress.

Read why Pornhub was ditched in 2020/2022. Trigger alert, it involves rape and trafficking victims.

Or read the sources mijoharas posted. They specifically say that payment processors simply do not like porn. I guess he did not read his own links.

[chownie]

Mijoharas and I both mentioned the adult industry, you've closed the scope down to just pornhub for some reason -- essentially you're arguing some other argument no one else made.

Payment providers note higher chargeback rates for adult/porn services than those for other mundane services, this is a longstanding -- pre-internet, even -- pattern which has nothing to do with the pornhub situation within the last 5 years.

[throwaway290]

pornhub is a good recent example of when payment processors ditched a major company due to csam scandal and this is very relevant to unregulated models.

> Payment providers note higher chargeback rates for adult

You get cause and effect inside out. Read the link posted by the guy you are defending https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24291790. Payment processors selectively nerf/buff industries. They see porn immoral and set stricter rules. Including lower allowed chargeback. And yes this means they actually make less money because of it. Believe it or not not everyone thinks money is everything. I give up if you guys actively resist facts.