[9rx]

> Basically in a nutshell he’s saying they dumbed down golang so it’s useable by beginners.

He's saying that developers can't handle Coq (the brilliant language), so they had to build a language that is like every other commonly used language, for better or worse.

> A failure in language development

As brilliant as Coq truly is, he's not wrong, is he? It is no coincidence that nobody is using Coq to build web servers. Which is, after all, what Pike said Go was designed for – that it was not intended to be a general purpose programming language. The vast majority of developers, even outside of Google, truly can't grasp it... And of even the scant few developers who can, they will tell you that the tradeoffs aren't worth it for something like a run-of-the-mill CRUD web server.

Your, being a researcher who does understand Coq, perspective is interesting from an academic angle, but Pike's point is that you don't understand the realities of engineering. This "Use Coq or you are no better than a Trump supporter" shows he was exactly on point. Cry as you might, nobody is going to be using Coq to build web servers, and for good reason.

[ninetyninenine]

No he's saying go is designed for people like you. You're obviously joking about COQ, but I'm not joking about you. This is literally what he's talking about. Take a step back out of your sarcasm and look at reality. You are the demographic Pike is talking about. And we both know Pike is not even referring to coq.

[9rx]

> No he's saying go is designed for people like you.

Stands to reason. It is true that I do spend my time on the engineering side of the industry. While I have great appreciation for the brilliant languages, they don't offer a whole lot for practical production work after you've weighed the tradeoffs. Especially in the particular niche Go is designed for. You are going to use a blub language like Rust for those types of problems, and for good reason.

> And we both know Pike is not even referring to coq.

Lean, then? The brilliant list isn't terribly long. We do know he isn't talking about Scala and Haskell, at least. He lumps them in with C++ and Java – albeit he has expressed that they are more beautiful. Not that anyone would consider them brilliant anyway. Well, maybe if you consider Trump to be also brilliant... There is always that guy.

[ninetyninenine]

It’s designed for people who don’t have much experience with programming. He literally said this. There is nothing said about coq or lean... that’s just trolling.

[9rx]

> It’s designed for people who don’t have much experience with programming.

Exactly. It follows the same basic "loop, variable, function" programming model as Java, C++, Haskell, PHP, Ruby, Rust, Python, LISP, Smalltalk, basically every language you've seen production code written in, that is familiar to early career beginners who have come out of traditional learning paths (e.g. college). Where once you understand one of them, you can jump into another with minimal overhead. None of these languages brilliant, but they are useful. Which is where he said they wanted Go to fit as well: A language that is useful and familiar.

That isn't what researchers and language theory enthusiasts want. They are enthralled by languages that think about programming in an entirely different way. The key point here is that it wasn't built for them. That is what he said.

[ninetyninenine]

That’s a stretch. Your saying he called golang not brilliant then you say basically every language from Haskell to Java is also not brilliant. Let’s be real here.

You also talk about looping for languages with no loops. And additionally pike never brought up looping at all. You just made this part up out of thin air. Your evidence is made up. He never said or referenced any of things you said.

> The key point here is that it wasn't built for them. That is what he said.

No read what he said again. He didn’t say golang was not designed for language experts. He did say it was designed for programmers just out of school with barely any experience with programming languages. He did not say he designed golang for an average engineeer who is not a PL expert he said he designed golang for literally people just out of school.

I don’t know how you can make stuff up out of thin air like this. Read what he literally said.