I feel like you are being overly hostile and you and saurik are both arguing the same point... maybe? Following this thread has not been easy, not sure which positions each of you are even defending.
I honestly clearly don't understand the downstream disagreement myself, am getting tired of being shouted at today, and feel like entering this part of the thread by replying to someone who was clearly already past their breaking point to defend what they had already claimed was an "idiotic take that many people seem to have", was a mistake ;P.