[ndiddy]

The whole point of Apple's pricing strategy over the past few years is that since they have a monopoly on storage/RAM upgrades, they can price base model computers at margins below what they'd normally be comfortable with, and then gouge users on the upgrade costs to claw back some of those margins. That's how they're able to charge $400 for an extra 16GB of RAM.

[kccqzy]

I doubt it. In corporate environments I see so many base models being used. Most office workers do everything on SaaS web apps anyway; they only need sufficient RAM to run a browser and browser-based apps. Having small amount of storage is a feature not a bug, because it prevents employees from downloading too much company proprietary information onto their laptops.

[aprilnya]

Same with stuff like OneDrive and SharePoint.

I do something similar with my personal laptops/PCs too — any actual files are in cloud storage[1], and mounted[2] so that they don't actually sync to the device, therefore not taking up space...

Honestly it feels very freeing having your data just be in server(s) somewhere, not having to worry about moving it between devices, or having to copy it over if you need to format/get rid of the device, or forgetting to copy over a file you need to your phone when going out, etc...

[1] Nextcloud rented from Hetzner https://www.hetzner.com/storage/storage-share/

[2] Nextcloud client has a feature called Virtual Files on Windows, and on Linux I just use the Nextcloud integration which uses WebDAV under the hood

[znpy]

> they only need sufficient RAM to run a browser and browser-based apps.

browser-bases apps are notoriously memory hogs, your point doesn't make much sense.

the truth is that apple get away with cheating a lot on their OS as they swap aggressively and do very aggressive swap compression.

the part about swapping aggressively is essentially overlooked by the entire industry: swapping to flash storage will wear it out faster, which is a huge issue when the flash chip is soldered and not replaceable. this will essentially create more e-waste (but they get to (happily) sell you a new laptop). so long for being green.

[sunshowers]

Everyone already knows this is what they do, they're just pointing out that it's abusive.

[usefulcat]

Abusive is a stretch. If you don't like it.. you're free to not buy from them?

[TheDong]

I'd be free to not buy from them if they released iMessage and facetime for android so people wouldn't get kicked from groupchats and prevented from being able to video call their grandmother when they switched phones.

Google hangouts / gmail works fine on iOS and android. Same for whatsapp, zoom, signal, etc. Heck, even microsoft teams.

Apple has more money than any of those companies, and yet also has the wildly most anti-competitive restrictive software, ensuring almost all of its services (apple music/books/iMessage/facetime/etc etc) more or less require all your devices to be apple devices.

I don't know if it's abusive, but it's certainly putting more chains on the user than any of the other similar ecosystems.

[TheSpiceIsLife]

This seems wildly overblown.

I'm running Windows laptops / desktops these days, and drive an iPhone and the sun hasn't exploded.

[sunshowers]

I don't buy from them and consider it abusive at the same time. What a concept.

[usefulcat]

I think "egregious" would be a fairer, more accurate adjective.

I know people who have been victims of actual abuse; it's not remotely the same thing as paying too much for a laptop.

[sunshowers]

I've been repeatedly abused for big parts of my life, and I have a CPTSD diagnosis from it.

It's not just paying too much, it's one of the world's most valuable mega-corporations asking you to pay too much. If it were a boutique shop I wouldn't call it abusive. It's a combination of the bad behavior and the exercise of raw power that makes it so.

[dijit]

The network effects of Apple devices are really tiny, compared to say: Microsoft, which holds nearly every company in Europe ransom in effect because Excel is a default tool you need to interact with your government in nearly every country as a business.

Sure, your iPhone doesn't connect as seamlessly to your Windows computer as it would a Mac, but those aren't network effects, thats vertical integration.

Nobody is forcing you to buy a Mac, and Apple themselves are intentionally overcharging for upgrades on the basis that: "If you really need it, you'll pay for it". Most people don't need it but will buy the upgrades anyway then complain that they're too expensive.

I'm aware that it limits the longevity of the devices, but that might also be intentional here, not abusive though. Just a bit bare-faced profit seeking. Which seems to be working because, as you point out, it's one of the worlds most valuable mega-corporations.

If someone else comes out with good premium laptops I'll move over happily, but for now the best laptop you can buy is unfortunately a macbook, and they've decided that upgrades are worth this money, if you don't agree then the answer is to simply not upgrade, or avoid the devices entirely.

[usefulcat]

I think I'd be in much more agreement with you if we were talking about people being forced to buy Apple products, but that's rarely if ever the case.

By and large, the people who buy these products are freely choosing to do so. To claim that, for those people, the price is "too high" is equivalent to telling them "you shouldn't be willing to pay that much for that product".

I think it's perfectly fine for me or any other individual to hold the opinion that their products are overpriced, but I think it would be at best borderline presumptuous for me to attempt to tell someone else what they should or should not value.

[ivanmontillam]

Yes, but it's perceived as abusive when two of the most feared devils come into play against you in a two-flanked attack: Network Effects and Vendor Lock-in.

I feel cornered when my social circle all use iPhones and then they want to Airdrop me something and I just can't receive it. I'm an Android man, I cannot stand the blue pill Apple feels to me.

Peer pressure is a serious threat, presented in the form of... abusive behaviour indeed.