[jowday]

I feel like you’re trying to launch a consumer product like it’s a B2B SaaS company. As it is (broken site with no polish, little to no gameplay features, product hunt banner) you seem like you’re to trying to chase AI/metaverse trends. Reminds me of all of the endless metaverse scams and scandals. I think you’re significantly underestimating the time and polish it takes to build a consumer 3D web based product . Most small game studios take years to build up even small games before releasing them.

If I were you, I’d think deeply about whether this is actually something you’re passionate about working on or if you just want to start a tech startup and chase trends. If the former is true, I’d close this down and work on it for a lot longer before ever showing it publicly. If it’s the latter I’d pivot to an LLM B2B SaaS company like everyone else like you and try your luck at that.

[stevekwon211]

Thanks for the great comment! Here’s what I think:

I don’t really understand why making a game has to take years. With AI advancing so quickly, the cost of game development is dropping fast—creating 3D assets, BGM, sound effects, characters, animations, and more is becoming way easier and faster. So instead of the traditional waterfall approach of long development cycles before launch, I think it’s now possible to build games in a more agile way.

It might look similar to a B2B SaaS approach, but we intentionally posted on platforms like Product Hunt and Hacker News to get feedback from talented people in the industry. Meanwhile, we’re running a separate GTM strategy to actually bring in our ideal customer profiles (ICPs) and learning from that.

Also, I’m genuinely serious about games—not just because of AI or the metaverse hype, but because I truly believe there’s a huge opportunity here. I wrote a piece about my thoughts—if you’re interested, I’d really appreciate it if you gave it a read!

https://blog.0.space/p/the-next-internet-is-3d

[jowday]

I’ve evaluated almost any model that’s come out for game asset generation in the last few years and none of them are up to snuff. That alone tells me you haven’t looked at the output of these models closely or aren’t familiar with Gamedev.

Also, I’m sorry dude, but your blog sounds exactly like every metaverse pitch I’ve ever seen. Down to the “ROBLOX, MINECRAFT, ETC” highlight at the end. This doesn’t make me feel like I’m reading something written by someone that cares about games - it makes me think the author reads a lot of VC substacks and played League of Legends for a while.

Even mentioning “GTM strategy” and “ideal customer profile” tells me you’re drinking a lot of Kool aid. Stop watching YC videos aimed at B2B SaaS founders and reading a16z blogposts and work a lot harder on this stuff if you ever want to show it publicly.

Also keep in mind, there’s probably literally 100 other companies with the same pitch, vibe, and idea that you have.

[stevekwon211]

> This doesn’t make me feel like I’m reading something written by someone that cares about games - it makes me think the author reads a lot of VC substacks and played League of Legends for a while.

After reading this sentence, I realize that the way I wrote might have come across that way. I’m a gamer who plays a lot of games and I’m so passionate about them that I even watch documentaries about the history of games. I have a lot of respect for people in the gaming industry. If my sincerity didn’t come through in that post, I guess that’s a limitation of my writing skills. There’s definitely a lot to improve on. I really appreciate this comment again

[stevekwon211]

Really appreciate the honest and direct feedback. You’re probably right, I’ve been consuming a lot of YC and a16z content, maybe too much. And yeah, I’m ready to put in the work and dive deeper into this space

Thanks for taking the time to read and leave a comment. I’ll keep pushing, refine the quality, and make something great

[taormina]

Any can build games in an agile way and people have been for years. That's not new.

People who don't understand that HN and PH are really not a good places to find real gamers are a dime a dozen. Don't worry, I have done this myself as well.

Games take a while to make if you care about the details. If you want to create an engaging and interesting world that players want to engage with, that polish takes time. But AI is saving the entire industry time and effort. But sure, dump a game out incrementally. I just don't see a new opportunity, just the opportunity that has always been there.

No Man's Sky was there to tell us that you can generate a whole universe but if you forget to put anything your players want to interact with, you'll only get so far.

I mean, good luck. I don't mean to be pessimistic, I just spend enough time every day watching indie devs pitch their half-baked game ideas that this is unoriginal.

[stevekwon211]

I said it wasn’t agile because the cycle between launching and getting player feedback takes too long.

And yeah, I agree it’s not really a new opportunity, just one that’s always been there. It just hasn’t been done right yet.

Games just need to be fun and well-made. I’ll put in the work to make it happen. Thanks for the comment!

[DanHulton]

> I don’t really understand why making a game has to take years.

Well, be prepared to find out. You're firmly in the "those who do not understand history are doomed to repeat it" zone right now.

And before you reflexively reply that you're using AI in a fashion that nobody else has before you, I want you to consider just how much the average "big budget" game has ballooned in size and budget despite decades of advancement in tooling designed to streamline and speed up the development process. The increased scope of modern games has far more than counter-acted any sort of productivity gains we've experienced, leaving us with the multi-year development cycles you lament. And the scope of your game is, by your own admission, infinite, so basic math tells us that if there's even a tiny non-zero amount of effort involved in creating it, the development time required will be infinite as well. Consider strongly setting yourself some firm limits ASAP.

And not just for the sake of your development budget! Consider also this: a game in which you can do anything with anything to anything, with no limits, no restrictions, only utter personal player freedom? That's not a game anymore. It doesn't even sound fun; it's basically an imprecise artist's palette. This may be briefly amusing to tinker with, but it'll never be FUN.

Games are fun largely because they have very deliberate limits that we have to learn and exert mastery over to overcome. Defining and fine-tuning those limits, and the tools the player is provided is at the root of game design, and you have punted on it entirely, leaving you with not a game, but a toy. (And, to my personal taste, a not very fun toy, though you could always turn that around with the judicious application of some excellent taste, instead of an abdication of same.)

I know this is a very grumpy comment, but boy it really gets my goat when someone says "I don't know why this thing is this way" and then doesn't bother to try to find out, and instead just assumes everyone else is an idiot who hasn't bothered to think about or try anything new. Sometimes it do in fact be that way, but you have to do at least the bare minimum of investigation to find out if it is, and in this case, you clearly have not.

Let me leave you with one last thing to think about: you mention Minecraft in other comments here, but consider the explosion in popularity it enjoyed when it introduced Survival mode -- a mode that contrasted the existing Creative mode by the addition of... limits. And to this day, that is the most-frequently played mode, almost to exclusion.

Players prefer limits. That's where the game is found.

[stevekwon211]

I don't find your comment frustrating at all. I really appreciate it.

To give you a bit of personal background, I'm a heavy gamer and I absolutely love the games I mentioned. I also fully understand why limits exist in games and why they are essential. It's one of the reasons I still enjoy those games.

However, I don't believe that the need for years of development is inherently tied to the existence of limits in a game. Whether or not a game has limits, if it doesn’t take too long to make, that's a good thing. Here, the point isn’t about the presence or absence of limits, but rather about the process of making, launching, and improving a game itself.

That said, as you mentioned, of course, my game will need rules and limitations. After all, that's what makes it a game. Your point about Minecraft's Survival mode was a great reminder and inspiration. Thanks for the valuable feedback, I’ll definitely give it some deep thought.

Lastly, I’ve never thought of anyone as a fool. If that’s how I came across, I apologize. I simply question the way things have always been done and explore different approaches. I’ve certainly looked into why things are done the way they are, but it seems that my intentions weren’t fully conveyed in my writing or the game itself.