[hyperpape]

> the JVM all but forces on you

I don't think you're wrong, but you're making this sound like it an issue with the JVM. It's certainly not. I guess it could be an issue with the Java language, but I don't really think so.

Mostly it's an issue with the Java ecosystem.

[chamomeal]

Yeah sounds more like a java issue to me. Clojure is usually beautifully terse and straight-to-business with very little boilerplate, and it usually runs on the jvm.

But still agree with the other commenter on the benefits of go. I’m not a huge fan of go, but it’s definitely encourages grug brain style (https://grugbrain.dev/) which has many benefits.

In fact, the only time I disagree with grug style is when I’m really close to the perfect generics for a TS function with lots of coupled inputs. Always so close…