[mplanchard]

That doesn't account for steel, aluminum, vehicles, etc. We import $12B of aluminum alone, $51B of vehicles, etc. etc. etc.[0] The large majority of stuff we import is raw goods that you can't just avoid as a consumer.

Re: energy independence, US was not "energy independent" in that we didn't import any energy. We were (and still are) energy independent in that we produce more than we consume, much of which is exported (which makes money for US corporations). Tariffs threaten those export relationships, and it's not trivial to just ship electricity wherever it's needed. It's far easier for us in the North to get electricity from Canada than to ship it in from the desert or something.

[0]: https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/imports/canada

[SiliconSplash]

> That doesn't account for steel, aluminum, vehicles, etc. We import $12B of aluminum alone, $51B of vehicles, etc. etc. etc.[0] The large majority of stuff we import is raw goods that you can't just avoid as a consumer.

The biggest issue I have when having these discussions is that people assume that the situation currently is what will always be. Part of rationale behind the Tariff is that you increase domestic production. Obviously it isn't going to happen over night, but the cure for high prices, is high prices as this will create the incentive for people to domestically produce.

> Re: energy independence, US was not "energy independent" in that we didn't import any energy. We were (and still are) energy independent in that we produce more than we consume

Right so you could meet the energy needs right?

> Tariffs threaten those export relationships, and it's not trivial to just ship electricity wherever it's needed. It's far easier for us in the North to get electricity from Canada than to ship it in from the desert or something.

It may not be. However the entire point is to create a incentive to solve these problems domestically.

[mplanchard]

> Right so you could meet the energy needs right?

Did you miss the part where I talked about how you can’t just magically ship electricity wherever it’s needed?

[SiliconSplash]

No I did not. It will be something that can be solved. It isn't going to be solved tomorrow, sure. But the world isn't static. If the right incentives exists, a solution will be found. The whole point of tariffs is to create the incentive in the first place.

I literally started off my previous reply by prefacing my frustrating around discussions of this type where people assume the current situation is going to stay in place as is. Sure in the short term things maybe negatively affected however in the long term there are benefits, one which is often over looked is a more robust domestic supply chain, which was a real problem back in 2020.