[User23]

What do you mean "we?" China has not just indicated but incontrovertibly demonstrated that they do not care about carbon dioxide emission targets. They are massively ramping up their oxidative energy production. So as I see it there are two choices.

One: deindustrialize and let China control all industrial production while having massive carbon dioxide emissions or,

Two: reindustrialize and challenge China's industrial production advantage while having massive carbon dioxide emissions.

Low emissions aren't on the table. They're not a possibility. So at this point I'm deeply suspicious of anyone peddling that fantasy. They are, most likely, spreading Chinese misinformation, wittingly or unwittingly.

[ben_w]

China is rapidly ramping up everything, including renewables. Biggest CO2 source in China right now is coal, and PV is much cheaper than coal, so them getting cleaner isn't even a question of them playing nice or thinking long-term, it's fully compatible with their own immediate interests.

[boshomi]

Chinese wind project developers ordered 228.4GW of wind turbines in 2024 (2023 96.3 GW, +137%)

The average price was onshore with tower: 1894 Yuan/kW onshore without tower: 1513 Yuan/kW offshore with tower: 3307 Yuan/kW offshore without tower: 2698 Yuan/kW

source: https://wind.in-en.com/html/wind-2456186.shtml (chinese)

In 2024, 121GW of wind turbines were connected to the grid worldwide, 80GW of which in China, 41GW worldwide outside China. In 2023, China added 77 out of 112GW

[rtsil]

Reindustrialization isn't possible because you cannot reduce your costs to China levels, particularly if you clamp down on immigration as well. The best you can hope for is to diversify the supply by industrializing other, geographically and/or ideologically closer countries that can produce at reduced costs and are also more dependent on your economy or your military might. A suite of vassal countries, if you will.

[vimy]

The humanoid robots will make reindustrialization very cheap.

[ben_w]

Do humanoid robots in America have any economic benefit over the exact same robots in, say, Mexico? Or on a lights-out factory on the ocean floor in international waters? Or on the moon?

Even if they're physically in the US, are these robots driven by AI, or remote control? If the former, does this re-industrialisation create any jobs? If the latter, why hire Americans to control the robots rather than much cheaper Cubans or Vietnamese or Salvadorans?

[danaris]

Are the humanoid robots in the room with us now?

[8note]

on the other hand, the replicators will make both the humanoid robots and reindustrialization irrelevant

[bokoharambe]

Much sillier to think "reindustrialization" is possible. It is a problem of social metabolism, not a policy issue. Industrialization was a particular historical phenomenon that has now fully passed in the West.

China "won" before the game even began for the simple fact of them being a very late developer. Development is not even guaranteed as a consequence of industrialization anymore; see premature deindustrialization. No misinformation needed, just cold hard historical laws.