[9dev]

That makes little sense. Why would a country be equally afraid of the influence of its citizens compared to a foreign, authoritarian regime with opposing interest? Given the choice, naturally you’ll be on the side of your own people rather than the others.

[6P58r3MXJSLi]

> Given the choice

I would chose China, which is on the other side of the globe, has no military bases in my country (USA have 3! two of them with nuclear capabilities) and probably what they gather from me make little or no sense to them and can't really influence me the same way (not even close to it) content in my language, repeated day and night from the top government bodies to the least popular piece of media that then spread from mouth to mouth and becomes a discussion topic at family gatherings, can.

No way tik tok remotely has that power, no way China could really do anything like that, they can at most insinuate through the cracks already present in our contemporary societies hoping it will work, but banning tik tok will only widen them.

It's one of those situation where having a common enemy should reunite people with opposing views, but it's not evil aliens trying to conquer earth we are fighting, it's social content (mostly entertainment) that this time will take people with opposing views even more apart.

[9dev]

And that’s where you’re dead wrong. TikTok is a vessel for any kind of content, with no visibility into the reason why a specific kind of information is displayed to whom. Just think of Field Manual 30-31B if you doubt this capability could be put to good use in a propaganda campaign, if necessary.

Sometimes, public opinion can be swayed very easily, by igniting the first spark with something outrageous; this is especially fruitful in times where the president of the United States openly opposes journalism, spreads lies, and generally fosters distrust and doubt. Lots of people are more inclined to believe a random TikTok than a professional journalist with decades of experience; what do you think were to happen if the Chinese government sees immediate value in the US government making a specific decision to their benefit, and one of the tools in their toolbox is playing a flurry of short videos to millions of American citizens, made to influence their understanding of an issue?

Most people will follow a reasonable opinion if it's the first time they're confronted with a complex situation. TiktTok is the perfect tool to exploit this, by delivering this opinion to absurdly narrow target groups, in a matter of seconds. Just because you don't notice this right now does neither mean the capability doesn't exist nor that it isn't already happening—which may be one of the reasons there is a bipartisan effort to pull through.

[6P58r3MXJSLi]

> is a vessel for any kind of content, with no visibility into the reason why a specific kind of information is displayed to whom

and that makes it different from IG, Facebook, X, YouTube (etc etc) how exactly?

[9dev]

That China is a totalitarian regime, and the USA (at least for now) is a democracy.

With all due criticism, there are still checks and balances in place in the US that make it a very different place. We're not talking about an objectively "correct" decision here, but what is in the best interest of the USA and its allies, and that certainly makes a difference when it comes to foreign influence on the own populace.

All that being said: American Tech companies are dangerous in their own right, and nothing in my post was defending these either. But that doesn't make TikTok less of a threat.

[6P58r3MXJSLi]

> That China is a totalitarian regime, and the USA (at least for now) is a democracy.

This is actually false.

The USA are a Republic, not a democracy. By constitution.

> there are still checks and balances in place in the US

If you are rich, maybe it's true.

I give you that.

> but what is in the best interest of the USA and its allies

The US has no allies. My Country is a vassal of the US, we cannot decide anything geopolitically relevant on our own.

Can we for example exit NATO? Of course we can't! They got military bases here, with atomic missiles, recently updated.

We can't even negotiate the release of one of our own independently without the US giving the thumb up/down.

So, please, before saying that what they do it's in our best interest, please, ask us.

It's usually not, BTW.

> But that doesn't make TikTok less of a threat

My point: same threat should result in the same response to the threat.

We should ban any non European propaganda machine on our soil.

One simple example: we all know what went down with Cambridge Analytica and yet if you look for it, you won't find any reference to trials or convictions, because there was none! it had a massive influence on shifting political view of the people in UK and in the US, but you'll only find vague scolds to bad apples that unilaterally abused of one - with a clear conscience - social network, unknowingly to the management. Despite a ton of evidence of the contrary.

How can you explain that?

[9dev]

We're talking past each other. You're neither a citizen of the USA nor China, and since China has even less connection to your home country, you'd rather accept their influence than the US's—which is probably fair (even though I wouldn't assume that China is thinking of you any less dispensable).

But that is not the talking point here. The current situation is the USA effectively banning TikTok in the USA to ensure national security.

The particular interests of other foreign countries are not being considered here, and I honestly don't quite understand why you think they should be? It's not like the USA is forcing this decision on everyone else.

> How can you explain that?

Now look; I'm not an American myself. I'm also appalled at what Meta and X are doing; it's all awful. But this particular decision? It's just not about us, and yet I can still try to understand why it was taken, and how I think it is the correct one, from the perspective of the USA.

[mint2]

Is tik tok even banned in your country? Since your perspective is choosing between two foreign powers controlling social media, sounds like an entirely different thing than in the US.

[bjourne]

Well, you write that it "makes little sense" then you argue that the maxim "China man bad, America man good" makes total sense...

[9dev]

No, then you didn't read it properly. I argue for "I trust my people more than my enemy", which doesn't sound quite as dumb and is something most people would probably agree with.

[bjourne]

Yes, I did read it properly, just like the above comment. You claim Chinese people as your enemy because your rulers told you so. That is very much jingoism and very much on the path to fascism. Sorry that you can't think for yourself.

[9dev]

I do not claim anyone my enemy, for I am not an American at all. I do, however, see the situation for what it is; the USA and China are political superpowers with opposing interest. Pretending like the world is a peaceful place is just a fantasy. Hence, you can’t just ignore a communication tool used by half the population in your strategic considerations. That is not racism, it’s not fascism, its pragmatism in the face of something very powerful that could well be abused.