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by gf000 517 days ago
What percentile? Topics like these don't talk about the 5G connected iphone 16 pro max, but have to include low-end phones with old OS versions and bad connectivity (e.g. try the same network connectivity in the London metro, where often there is no receiption whatsoever).

As you reach for higher percentiles, RTT and such start growing very fast.

Edit: other commenter mentioned 75% as percentile.
2 comments
fingerlocks 517 days ago
Independent of connectivity, UI rendering should be well under the device refresh rate. Consider the overhead of a modern video game that runs 60fps without a hiccup. It’s ludicrous that a CRUD app which usually only populates some text fields and maybe a small image or two can’t do the same
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gf000 516 days ago
That's a page load, not a frame render.

Also, due to layouting, a CRUD app may actually be harder to optimize per frame, than the trivial to parallelize many triangle case as seen in games.

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fingerlocks 516 days ago
OP gave a render budget of 100ms _after_ the data has loaded. That’s unacceptable. If this were a MacOS app, that would mean dragging a window corner to resize the content , forcing a new layout and redraw, would yield 10 fps of change. And yet nearly all native apps redraw and layout instantly, even with complex tables of text at various fonts and sizes.

This is also a great litmus test to check if an app was made with electron because they always redraw slowly.

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fidotron 517 days ago
> What percentile?

There's no argument that starts this way which doesn't end either with "support working offline", or defining when you consider that a user has stepped out of bounds with respect to acceptable parameters, which then raises the question what do you do in that event?

If all you're trying to do is say 75% of users have a good experience, and in your territory 75% means a 150ms and that's too long then the network cannot be in your critical path, and you have to deal with it. If you're on a low end phone any I/O at all is going to kill you, including loading too much code, and needs to be out of the way.

If you can tell the UX is going to be bad you will need to abort and tell them that, though they really will not like it, it's often better to prevent such users ever getting your app in the first place.

I come from mobile games, and supported titles with tens of millions of players around the world back in the early 4G era. All I can tell you is not once did mobile ping become a concern - in fact those networks are shockingly good compared to wifi.

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