[nanolith]

To each their own. With Vim, Unix is my IDE. I don't know about the recent interest in these editors that you mention. I've been using vi/Vim for the past 30 years. I take it to every project and job. My fingers already know what to do. I've watched colleagues who I started working with 20 years ago as they've retooled on the latest hotness every 4-5 years. Visual Studio, Netbeans, Eclipse, Jetbrains, VS Code, etc. It doesn't take long to learn to use a new IDE, but they are definitely shorter term investments.

I can do more or less the same thing most folks can with an IDE; I just use external tools. I wouldn't claim that Vim is somehow superior. It's just what I use. Every now and then, I noodle a bit on a personal editor that is to ed what Vim is to vi. At some point, I'll migrate to it.

I think there is a bit of a different philosophy that the editor folks have. I can't speak for them, but I can speak for me. I like to feel closer to the code base. I like to have more of it in my head. The best analogy I've found is that using an editor like Vim or Emacs is closer to driving with a manual transmission and with tight steering controls, compared to driving with an automatic transmission with partial self-driving features found in modern cars. There is definitely something to be said about things like adaptive cruise control, lane keeping assist, GPS navigation, etc. But, if you talk to a manual transmission enthusiast, there is a thrill of feeling closer to the road and being more engaged. Both folks arrive at the destination in the same amount of time. But, if you ask each about their experience, they will have much different views of the drive organized in their head.

[Shorel]

> I wouldn't claim that Vim is somehow superior. It's just what I use.

Exactly, that's your editor and you are used to it. There is no reason at all for you to consider to change editors.

I use Sublime Text, it's my editor, it has been for a decade and I am used to it.

I don't have Copilot or similar, and I'm glad I don't. Not interested in such a thing.

[snozolli]

To each their own.

And yet I get down-voted for expressing a well-reasoned opinion against vim and Emacs.

I've been using vi/Vim for the past 30 years. I take it to every project and job.

I've rarely used an IDE that didn't allow custom key bindings, often with the ability to select a set from a drop-down list to match other IDEs. I've been using mostly the same keyboard shortcuts across IDEs for over 20 years.

if you talk to a manual transmission enthusiast, there is a thrill of feeling closer to the road and being more engaged

Funny you should say that, because I regularly enrage these types by pointing out that if they can't stay engaged as a driver with an automatic transmission, then the problem is with them, not the car. This is a quasi-religious ritual with these people, and a very low-effort way to get a sense of superiority over others (i.e. every driver on the road before ~1970 had experience with a manual transmission and literally anyone can learn in a few hours. It's not a skill to be proud of).

[nanolith]

and a very low-effort way to get a sense of superiority over others... literally anyone can learn in a few hours.

I agree that it is a skill that is easy to learn. The same is true of IDEs. This isn't about skill or superiority, but comfort. Some folks are more comfortable being closer to the machine or the road, as it were. Others are more comfortable having some automation between them and the machine. I think that the better to consider this a matter of personal preference.

The IDE adds a layer of abstraction, and abstraction can be leaky. If you are comfortable with the abstraction, and with the opinionated choices the IDE makes, that's fine. If you are not, that's also fine. All that I ask when I'm bootstrapping a project with a team is that projects be arranged such that they are IDE / editor agnostic. Use standard build configuration / build tools that have appropriate plugins for IDEs, and can also be run in the terminal / command-line. Then, the individual developer can choose to use whichever editor or IDE that developer is comfortable using.

[snozolli]

This isn't about skill or superiority, but comfort.

The down-votes that I continue to get in this thread tell a different story.

[troad]

> And yet I get down-voted for expressing a well-reasoned opinion against vim and Emacs.

Calling people whose editor preferences differ from yours "obsessed" "editor-hipsters" is not a well-reasoned opinion, nor is saying that people who drive manual are engaged in a "quasi-religious ritual" to feel a false "sense of superiority". Those are just insults. Hence the downvotes, I suspect.

No one here is forcing you to use any editor, you've only got people trying to explain to you what they find valuable in the tools you're attacking. You're coming off as someone with a major chip on his shoulder. You may use whatever editor you like, but you should consider extending the same courtesy to others.